A Note about the X-Files Fandom

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Title:	A Note about the X-Files Fandom
Creator:	adieangel
Date(s):	September 8, 2015
Medium:	Tumblr post
Fandom:	X-Files
Topic:
External Links:	A Note about the X-Files Fandom - violent daylight, Archived version
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A Note about the X-Files Fandom is a Tumblr post by adieangel. It was posted on September 8, 2015, and had 899 notes three days later.

The subject was The X-Files, demographics, age of fans, and fandom and ageism.

It was written around the same time as a historical note and was a response to a series of tumblr posts which addressed homophobia, transphobia, and "older X-Files fans." See:

The Post

Note: I wrote this right around the time dashakay wrote her version, and am posting it with her blessing. I’m sorry if they overlap. I swear it’s entirely coincidental.

I don’t want to get involved in the whole drama, but I feel like maybe the OP should learn a little X-Files fandom history. And since my master’s happens to be in broadcasting and X-Files has been my fandom for 21 years, I can help you out.

When X-Files started in 1993, people watched it live, with commercials, as it aired on television. When the fandom started, it was mostly adults, by virtue of the fact that children and teens didn’t have access to the Internet or even a computer unless they were in school. When I was watching this show in high school, I was lucky enough to have parents with a single computer in the living room and dial-up internet access. I found the fandom on CompuServe and was literally the youngest person there by 10 years. And I was 14. Throughout my time as a part of this fandom, I was teased constantly (lovingly, mostly) for how young I was and how much learning and growing I still had to do. I made friends with college students and moms and wonderful older women who were caring and amazing and helped me navigate this new world.

To come into this fandom and say that this show was marketed toward teenagers? And that adults don’t belong in this fandom? You’re flying in the face of its entire history. The X-Files prime Nielsen demographic targets were 18-49. That was the most popular viewing age for the show. That’s who the show was marketed towards. Not 14 or 16. 18 was the bottom. The average viewer was in their mid- to late-20s. They had jobs and families that came home to watch tv together at the end of the day. The people who wrote most of the classic fan fiction we have today were in their 20s at the time, or 30s. We had fans going through cancer treatments and sending their children off to college and getting tenure at the university they taught at. Teenagers were the minority and the exception.

Today, most teenage fans have computers and Internet access and have seemingly forgotten on whose shoulders they stand to have what they do. The entire infrastructure of this fandom was created by adults, not teens. Those Gossamer archives, for example, were around nearly a decade by the time fanfiction.net was created, and created by an engineering teacher at Ohio State. Unlike newer and younger fandoms like Harry Potter and Twilight, we were created by adults for adults. About an adult show with adult characters in adult situations.

That’s not to say teenaged fans aren’t welcome. It’s a good show that still resonates with a lot of people. I started when I was a teen, so I think it’s awesome that you want to come play in the sandbox with us.

You can talk about feeling outnumbered and unheard in this fandom. Those are valid complaints and believe me I’ve been there. You can talk about the old-fashioned and outdated ideals and opinions about these characters, and you would have a valid point because, yeah, some of us are old.

But please don’t come into this fandom and make claims that it’s for teens and that adults should gtfo. This isn’t the CW. This isn’t YA section at Barnes and Noble. This is a fandom that has been around for over 20 years, whose stars are entering or passing middle age. Whose primary villain is over 70 freaking years old. The fact that you can find fans in their 30s here means they were probably younger than you when this show premiered. So some of what you’re going through? We went through it.

And, finally, on another note, the OP should probably know that only 15% of tumblr users are under 18, so it’s inaccurate to say that we are “invading” a space meant for children. tags: #Silly rabbit #don't talk about fandom to people who've been in it for this long and not expect to learn something #Xf fandom #xf history

Comments to the Post: At the Original Post

[stoplookingup]:

No idea what this is in response to, but just want to affirm its truth. I was in my early 30s when XF started. I hung around on alt.tv.x-files.creative a lot through the mid- to late-90s, pre-Haven. I communicated with a lot of other fans during those years. I don’t recall ever being aware that any were teenagers. Given that online access was still limited to early adopters, many of whom gained access through their jobs, that’s no surprise. We were absolutely operating under the assumption that the fandom consisted primarily of adults – I remember discussions about rating fics to protect ourselves from liability should minors stumble across our work (not to mention the disclaimers we included because of our worries that Fox would crack down on copyright violation). And at the risk of stirring controversy, I have to say, older fandom was, on the whole, nicer fandom. While there was certainly some conflict (remember shippers vs. noromos?), much of it was pretty civil, and the worst of it was nothing compared to what came later. I returned to online fandom a couple of years after the relaunch of Doctor Who, and I was pretty shocked at the flame wars, sporking, anon hate, etc. And it only got worse as time went on.

So if anyone is saying us old folks should GTFO, that’s just…amusing. I’ll be over here, enjoying the company of some of the lovely XF fandom friends I’ve had for a couple of decades now, and hoping to make some news ones, young and old.

[mustangsally78]:

A LOT OF IT HAD TO DO WITH MONEY. I WAS A WORKING ADULT AND HAD TO PLUNK DOWN ABOUT TWO GRAND FOR A COMPUTER IN ‘95. NOT EVERYONE HAD THE ACCESS THAT THEY DO NOW.

[linzeestyle]:

I was 13 when I started watching XF, and 14 when my family got our first computer: in the living room, on a 56k modem that could only be used after 10:30 because we had one phone line and my parents have a family business (they do not save people nor hunt things). I was one of only five, perhaps six fans I knew who (after a fair amount of time) admitted to being under 21, and I was publicly “around eighteen” for a good, long while. I’m rather finished finding kind ways to say this: fandom is not a youth space. It is a subculture, a rich one with a very long history, pre-dating your parents, mine, and arguably even theirs (fun fact: the term “fan” was first used derisively to refer to largely female-identifying theater-goers at the turn of the 20th century, in reference to the belief they were ‘taking up seats’ by going to shoes they were not appreciating, only to ogle the actors. Gee, sound familiar?). Youth-oriented spaces within fandom are a fairly new construction, enabled by the rise of the internet and the ability of fans to connect with other fans, and share their enthusiasm for the texts they love, at lower and lower entry cost. It’s a wonderful addition to fan culture but it is a ripple in the pool of fan history. Fan space is not “youth space.” There is a good deal of overlap, and it is very possible to make your space consist of only your peer group – regardless of your age. But it is not a default and Tumblr’s insistence otherwise is absurd, particularly as it continues to utilize the aspects of fan-culture that are, let’s be honest, very clearly the work of older fans, from the OTW and AO3 to the changes in copyright law that allow for the sharing of high-quality gifsetst and fanvids, to a good portion of the fanfic and fanart you consume. This isn’t to say we shouldn’t be aware of age differences online; we should be conscious of how we handle ourselves in all public spaces, particularly those of us on the adult end of the scale. But that is exactly what fandom is: a public space. And one that was built by, and for everyone. There are other replies to this post that have backed this up with tumblr user-statistics and facts, and I’m not going to do that because frankly, I’m tired of chasing my tail over the absolute obvious: fandom is not an age-related hobby. Your younger sibling might be reading that Sherlock story you wrote, but it’s just as likely (if not more) that the last Destiel fic you read was written by your intro to American Literature instructor. Because you might grow out of wearing that Cosplay Tardis dress in public on a day-to-day basis, but you no more grow out of having a Mulder funko pop on your office desk, or the “Star Spangled Man With A Plan” as your ringtone, than you will your love of listening to glam rock, or buying anything with subtle rivets, or incorporating doc marten boots into reasonable day wear. Because, say it with me now: fandom is a subculture. You don’t “grow out of it.” It incorporates.

Tumblr will just have to incorporate, too.

[destinaf]:

Is this sort of like ‘damn grannies, get off my lawn’? Because I’m pretty sure Granny planted the lawn upon which the children frolic.

[dropletofjupiter]: {{Quotation| Watch it you little piss ants we’re older and have better insurance. 22 years here WHATS GOOD. AOL chatrooms bitches. We had to wait for sweeps week. Do you guys even know what the fuck that is? Netflix brats? Y’all spoilt. Y’all need a time out. >:-{ }}

[culturevulture73]:

Also OG Phile, started online around 1994, I think. I’d download a disk of fic from the Ohio State archives at work to read on my non Internet access home computer (my first one with access had a 56k modem). I was on alt.tv.xfiles, but later. First on the Chaos mailing list. I fell out of the fandom after the show ended but the people on the lists I was on were mainly older - my fan friends from the lists all had jobs. What’s fun for me us coming back and seeing people love eps that were HATED by fandom at the time (Ghosts Stole Christmas, for example). The biggest fight I remember was the contretemps over David leaving.

And so far as I know, XF fandom started the use of shipping as a verb for wanting a pairing. And that was back in the day.

[shelikespretties]:

Whaaaaaat? Someone is seriously trying to say we grown ups are now “invading” X-Files fandom???

Bwahahahahahaha OH Tumblr. You love all the -isms except for ageism.

[listerinezero]:

I spent SO MANY HOURS (on DIAL UP INTERNET) reading every fan’s every thought and every theory about every moment of every episode of The X-Files. I didn’t get that into fanfic then - I read a few but it wasn’t my scene - I just read and read and read all the message boards and all the conspiracy theories and saved EVERY IMAGE OF KRYCEK I COULD GET MY MOUSE ON. Good times.

[phoenix-flo-az]:

I don’t know what is going on either but I was 16 when XFiles first started airing, and about 17-18 when I went online and started to interact. I never recalled anyone asking my age, or it being important when discussing the show. But I did become friends with people of all ages. I don’t know. Maybe it was due to that time and the difference in maturity levels? Different time? Anyways, I just want to enjoy the pretty gifs. 😀

[braindamageeclipse]:

Dear fandom (any fandom): I truly don’t understand how the hell you think anymore. Back to writing the occasional fic but otherwise lurking in peace and quiet.

Tags: you'll never know how many wicked old folks secretly read your tumblr and fic you'll never know you'll never knoooooowwwwww you ain't getting any fucking feedback either

[wannaseeamonkey]:

The truth is in this post. Cheers to being an ORIGINAL ADULT HUMAN FAN. can we have our own club? The “over 30 and respectful of everyone’s rights to fangirl?”.

[lysergicgirl]:

Ok, now it has piqued my curiosity enough that what was the original post that spurred all this? I finally bring myself over to tumblr like, not even three days ago to party with my fandom and I have no idea how to fully even use this yet so hell if I can figure where all the noise is coming from.

[fordallstreams]:

This post tells the reality of this fandom. I’m probably one of the older people here, and I’ve been a great fan of the X-Files since it premiered. Those who are young and watching now, great. You have a place as fans just as much as anyone. But those of us who have been around since the show’s inception are going to keep on being around. :)

[boldly—we--go]:

i don’t know what this is referencing to, but honestly I don’t think X-Files could have even been marketed towards the younger demo…. I wasn’t even alive when it started, but I remember my mum and other adults watching it when it was my bedtime. It was on p-late at night, late enough where although the watershed doesn’t exist technically in the US, you can tell it was meant for adults. Also lol I finally got over myself and started watching it recently, but I was pretty traumatised by just the theme when I was growing up, and so were several of my other friends, I know. (I’m fuckin 20 now and the theme still gives me shivers. I don’t think I could have watched the actual show when I was younger.)

[exly]:

I’ve been a fan since I was a kid. I’m 31 now. It’s true, this fandom is built on the shoulders of adults making things happen for the first time. Building pages and forums, mail list and all the things that we as Philes initiated. Everybody has the right to think whatever the hell they want but you cannot negate the people who make this fandom what it is. Who make this a cult show and the phenomenon that it became.

[likesleepybunnies]:

I was 22 when I first saw The X-Files. I was fresh out of advertising school and could barely find a job. Probably didn’t have a computer of my own until I was 24. Didn’t get involved in fandom until I as 27 or 28 because I had a baby and had no time for a while. I remember quite well being about the same age as most of those involved in fandom and maybe a little younger. I had this notion that someday I wouldn’t be involved in fandom because my life would be so spectacular and filled with non-stop activity that I’d have no time for such things! Well, I was wrong. And here i still am. I have a son who is 19 and he has never suggested that I am too old for any of this. Not XF. Not Harry Potter (I was with all adults my age in that fandom, too), not Marvel, not anything I’ve ever been involved in. I didn’t know there was an age limit!

[soulslosthomeagain]:

OTHER FANDOM AND FANGIRLS

RESPECT THE ONES THAT CREATED A COMMUNITY AROUND A SHOW WHILE THE MAJORITY OF US WERE EITHER 1. NOT BORN YET 2. TOO YOUNG TO BE ONLINE AT THE TIME 3. DIDN’T HAVE A WHOLE LOT OF COMPUTER ACCESS.

RESPECT THEM

[rachg82]:

I was 14 when I discovered the fandom in ‘96, and I can definitely speak to the truth of this as well. Most of the fans I dealt with were older than me, and they were all generally extremely respectful.

[badforthefish]:

Hey, who said you couldn’t have interesting discussions on Tumblr, uh? I respectfully disagree with the notion that the fandom of old was a nicer place. I remember the flame wars, the nasty stuff that happened during The Witches controversy, the name calling…. etc, the authors who got blacklisted for daring to write Doggett and so on. There was condescending behaviour then, groups who badmouthed other groups, people being clickey or being accused of being clickey. These things are not new and tend to repeat themselves. I remember meeting many people at the 2008 London IWTB premiere who told me they’d left Haven for Live Journal because they got their head bitten off for disagreeing with the board’s divas or simply for speaking their mind. There was IMO way more drama in the newsgroups and boards than there is now. I find the this year’s fandom crop much more civilized, considerate and kind, (but maybe I’m simply not following the people who aren’t) Haven for instance is a much friendlier place than it ever was, imo. But I guess we all experience the fandom in different ways. I follow this simple rule: if it stops being fun and does your head in: walk away. Fandom should be a place where you come to have fun, not argue and fight, no matter how old you are. There will always be people within the fandom who thrive on drama and make mountains out of molehills, people who will say things you disagree with. Healthy discussions are good but it’s when it becomes a case of ‘us’ against ‘them’ that it starts to suck.

Anyway my 2 cents. :-)

[halfbreedauphe]:

I grew up within the fan subculture. My outlook on it was very different from the start as I was fully immersed in it since I was 7-8 years old. My parents were a part of a Star Trek ship (an actual club with various branches called different shop names, we were a part to the Ascension) and it was a very costly thing, conventions, associated shows, events, merchandise. It was really one of the best ways for fans to gather and collect things pre Internet. And while the internet did exist before 2000, the cost of it and access was limited. Very few children participated. Some did but if there were kids, typically they were being pulled along with their parents. If you met them out on the street, you might notice a trek tattoo or something, but just regular folk. They would try to include me in various discussion and whatnot, though some aspects were not discussed around the kid, certain non kid friendly stuff...

[elfwreck]:

YES YES YES. Fandom was not created by or for the young. Kids are welcome to join–we’re an inclusive bunch, and we love to share the squee–but we’re looking for people who are in this for life, not because of whoever’s hot in Hollywood this month. One of the parts of new fandom I really dislike is that kids create kid-friendly fannish zones and then despise them–and the kids who’ve joined them–when they get older.

Don’t like dating quizzes anymore? Fine. But there are kids who do, and new kids who create more “which [new boy band] member would you date?” games, and THEY ARE FANNISH TOO. If you hate the parts of fandom you’ve “grown out of,” you’re not fannish; you’re faddish.

[bylillian]:

Reblogging because I’ve been a fan since I was very young– I wrote fanfic in my notebook in the late 70′s (all Star Wars)–I started reading fanfic in the 90′s (XF and Highlander represent!). I love having all sorts of people in fandom now, of all ages. But it was not invented in 2010. :-)

[notimpossiblejustabitunlikely]:

I am not really in this particular fandom, but really? People are age-policing fandoms and saying adults should gtfo?

[dvswraatins]:

fandom is not a youth space - it is a subculture

Yes. That. Yunguns will have to deal with our old people smell, and just get used to us old timers farting publicly, saying inappropriate things around the dinner table, and damning everyone to hell. Now excuse me, grandma needs to read her stories.

[medieisme]:

also advice for newbie fans? unlike a few above who commented on how NICE the X-Files fandom was?

Honey, let me tell you a thing.

I was a Doggett/Scully shipper during seasons 8 & 9.

I can honestly say that was some of the worst fandom experience of my life because the MSR fans were fucking VICIOUS.

Take my advice, kids, do not pick a fight with old school X-File fandom. They will fuck you up six ways from Sunday and THEN they’ll go to work on you.

And THIS? They did in a time before social media. This was all on email, message board, and alt.tv.x-files.creative.

Yeah, no, do not pick a fight with old school XF fans. Do not try to drive off old school XF fans.

You are not prepared for that fight. I guarantee you that you are not prepared for that fight.

[badforthefish]:

Forgive my snippage but Adie’s XF fandom history post has gone quite viral. This reply from medieisme almost made me spit out my dentures.;-) I had to have it on my dash on its own. Remember the “Dogshit Authors” blacklist? Man you’re right, those were vicious days. I was on that list because I had the gall to have Doggett as a character in a story (not even in a ship!). I was so damn proud to have made the list. All Kurtzweil “you-know-my-work?” glee.

But yeah, you don’t wanna piss off the old XF fans. They fought the fandom Reavers of early internet days. They’re freakin’ SEASONED.

[badforthefish]:

geekmom7 said: they’ve survived slow dial up and leaving their personal emails to fight dirty. And read through a lot of good and bad fic.

[stillazarafteralltheseyears]:

Yeah, first time I saw this post come around, I was very tempted to add, “Yes, it was nice in the early days when I joined the fandom during S4, BUT…” Everything medieisme said. There is a reason I haven’t watched the show (except for one episode once when I was too lazy to change the channel) since it ended. Why I didn’t watch the last movie, and have no intention of watching the revival miniseries unless I suddenly hear that Robert Patrick is in it after all–although I doubt that’ll happen because he would’ve been filming Scorpion when they shot it. THAT’S how badly I got burned just for liking a character and a ‘ship that the majority of the fans (or possibly a REALLY vocal minority, but one that the majority made no effort to silence or police, if so) decided to hate. XF was the fandom that toughened me up, that lowered my BS meter to pretty much nothing. It is the REASON I am a bitter old fandom queen who takes no crap from nobody. I survived being a Doggett fan during season 8: there is NOTHING you whippersnappers can throw at me that I can’t handle and/or school you on. I made some of the best friends I will ever have in fandom in XF fandom, many of whom I am still in touch with today. (LOVE TO ALL MY HAREM SISTERS!) But at the same time, no fandom I’m in right now can touch XF fandom at its worst. What that has to do with age…I don’t know. I was in my late teens/early twenties at that point, and I have no idea the ages of the people who were the biggest trouble makers because I didn’t really care. I would like to think that even the most hot-headed of us have mellowed since then, but just because the dragon is sleeping doesn’t mean it’s a good idea to poke it.

And I realize that’s kind of off topic (topic being older fans are awesome–which we ARE, largely because we’ve been through the Wars and come out the other side and while we ARE still dragons, we’re dragons who can generally draw upon centuries of experience to find a reasonable solution before we go around flaming everything–and XF was not for teenagers–because, um, I’m pretty sure it was one of the first shows to get a TV-M rating for violence), but I think it needed to be said. Because yes, older fans have as much right to be in fannish spaces as younger ones, but I don’t feel that “because fandom was so much nicer in our day” is a valid argument when, um, it often WASN’T.

[pearwaldorf]:

Oh for fuck’s sake. As somebody who was a teenager in X-Files fandom, I was well aware of there being “adult” (or at least adult-ier) spaces and non-adult spaces. Most of my time online was spent on an AOL X-Files message board where the members spent time being young and goofy and dumb. It was some of the best times of my life, especially for an isolated teenage dweeb. And in spaces outside of that, you bet the adults and the AOL mods had no hesitations upbraiding us for stupid and annoying behavior, which there was sometimes, because lbr, young people can be short-sighted and rude in ways specific to the young. There’s plenty of things I did online that make me cringe when I think about it. And I am grateful that I was allowed that latitude, and that older fans modeled better behavior. But I/we (to my recall) never had any illusions about the amount of work that adults put into things for us, including Gossamer, listservs, and smaller fic archives.

(I am also grateful that pretty much everybody took us at our word that we were 18 when we joined the listservs where they kept the explicit fic.)

[amireal2u]:

I had unmonitored, unfettered access to the internet by age 14. We lived in a house with a second phone line because my dad worked in computers (god we had three lines at one point, it got a little insane) and I’m here to tell you I was the EXCEPTION to age and internet access, not the rule. And I was “18” from the moment I stepped into fandom space. I knew I had to be an adult, it was very clearly marked, and even without big ass neon signs, the atmosphere was that of adults expecting adults. (Though I’m sure some of you guessed, age was NEVER discussed openly, for everyone’s protection.) All those early websites and archive designs? They needed adults to pay or build them. Early listservs usually needed a member of academia in order to run b/c the only place with servers powerful enough and enough storage to run them but without the supervision and oversite that would get them shut down but WITH the easy access where university students. Usually masters or PhD students at least. Never at any point, unless I found someplace via an AOL BB board listing, was my age and “presence” expected to be ANYTHING but adult. God there was a few years where age statements where a THING. And those statements wanted you over 18.

Trust me kids, fandom was build on ADULT shoulders and wallets and we’re getting pretty PO’d by being told to get out, or even better, that we don’t belong here now.

[feanna]:

I joined fandom in my late teens, but I’ve ALWAYS been aware, that there ware many people older than me, contributing the most awesome stuff too! (I think the beginnings of Merlin fandom (on lj) that I was there for was the first fandom that skewed young, but still had awesome older writers/participants).

[ealasaidh]:

My mother, who is now in her 60s, is in a book about Star Trek fandom (she was really active in fandom when TOS was on the air) and is still a huge nerd. We saw Terminator 2 together almost a dozen times in theaters. She’s not active in online fandom, but she pinged me the instant she heard Stan Lee and the Woz are going to throw a con, to make sure I knew and would go with her, just like we went to cons together when I was younger.

Me, I’ve been a raving fangirl since I was about six. The X-Files was my first online fandom - my Dad joined an X-Files fan list on my behalf through his work email and shuttled emails back and forth from his office on floppies for me. (At least, until we finally got internet at home.) I met my Partner through a friend I made on a Matrix email list back in college, and I’ve been active on everything from Livejournal to Tumblr here as fandoms have shifted their bases of operation.

Fandom is all-ages, y’all, and pretty much always has been.

[thyladyx]:

I’ve never been part of the xf fandom, but I am seeing a lot of crap in all the fandoms I come across. It’s so ridiculous for young people to think this is a young space. I can’t even imagine what makes them think that. Maybe it’s because I entered the HP fandom, and nearly immediately fell into the Drarry ship when I was 11/12 sometimes back between GoF and OotP. I had read a few gen non relationship fics, and stumbled onto this one where Draco and Harry “became friends” (so I thought) and I liked it. It’s like “yes, this, why can’t they just get along” and then all of a sudden they were kissing. It never crossed my mind that other people my own age of 12 saw sexual attraction between Draco and Harry. It was a gift a more “worldly” person was sharing, that they could see from their own experiences that I hadn’t had yet. That they were generous enough to share and help us see things differently.

[emsage33]:

If you say older people should get out, especially of fandoms older than you are, please shut up. If any doctor who fan says that crap, when the show started over fifty years ago, you are nuts. Older people clearly had to have loved your show in order for it to still be around for you to watch it now- did you think they would magically stop loving it when they turned 30? My friends mom is mid 50’s and sends me Facebook links to all kinds of doctor who, Lotr, starwars, ect things because not only does she know I love them but she loves them too! And it’s awesome! If anyone is trying to discourage her and people like her from doing her thing, when she has been into this stuff way before I was born, they need to go evaluate their priorities. We should be there for each other, not be there for each other until other people “age out” of it.

[fierceawakening]:

I can’t speak for this fandom, but I have periodically run into young people in Transformers fandom who feel that they can tell older fans that we are making things unsafe for them, and basically expect that we will do whatever they ask.

I think the reasoning is that minors are less privileged than adults, and in that ubiquitous SJ-boilerplate way, one gets told “you are ‘an ally’ to minors, so you need to 'sit down, shut up, and listen.’”

Which troubles me. I think someone who feels unsafe should absolutely be able to say they do. But I also think that adults should be allowed to create content some people might find disturbing or triggering without ending up on “people to avoid” callout lists.

[skarrin]:

Oh ho ho ho.

You can just TRY policing me out of the fandom. I have years of practice shouting at clouds.

I need new targets to shout at.

[tea-and-liminality]:

Ask me about my 15 year old XF fic. Ask me about my two months-old Sherlock fic. Written when I was 34 and 48, respectively.

[particularscarf]:

Basically, fans and followers, if you were a small child or not yet born when I was watching a show, you have no right whatsoever to try and push me out of the fandom because of my age.

[unreconstructedfangirl]:

Just adding in my voice here. I was in my late 20′s early 30′s when I was obsessing constantly over the X-Files, reading fanfic, and frequenting alt.tv.x-files. The first fic I ever wrote was crazy self-insert romances about 80′s bands my friends and I loved in high school, and the second was for the X-Files, where I started realising that my friends and I weren’t alone in being obsessively fannish and writing stories about it. Also, you will pry the X-Files out of my metaphorical cold, dead hands.

[geekgirl1]:

I was also in my late 20s when I became an X-Files fan, I used to spend my time watching the episodes and thinking “I can’t wait until this is over until I can go check out alt.tv.x-files!” and Mulder/Scully was my first ship. I probably would not have the career I have now if I hadn’t taught myself web skills so that I could build fan sites and download binaries of David Duchovny photos.

There is so much unacknowledged sexism in these remarks too. Boys are expected to love sci-fi and sports, grow up and pass those passions along to their sons. Girls are expected to grow up, and become wives and mothers. Full stop.

[bitchwhoyoukiddin]:

*nods along* I can very accurately say that I spent at least five years as the fandom baby for every fandom I was in. I floated around the XF fandom but never really entered because I was basically shoo-ed away by well-meaning participants. I was 13 when the show premiered, and was also lucky enough to have internet access at home and at school, so I had WAY more access than others in my age range. But across the board, I was a child. The women - and YES, my fandom experience has been about 95% women up to present day - I interacted with were predominately at least 7+ years older than I was.

[arsenicsweetheart]:

Wherein the X-Files fandom, a longtime favorite show of mine, since my actual youth, I was in my teens when it started coming out on DVD box set, and it was hard to commit at the time to plunking down that kind of money, but I did it, politely and informatively throws some shade at the whippersnappers whining on the lawn.

[drst]:

Modern fan culture & practices we inherited from the Trek fandom was built largely by adult women. Everything you’re doing as a media fan has a legacy in the work of adult women. To say fandom is only for teenagers is ridiculous. Fandom is expensive. Attending conventions and making costumes and all that, it is still expensive, it’s just slightly less expensive now to made vids than it was back in the day. You can’t participate as a teenager all that well unless your parents are okay with it and paying. I’d also suggest those of you insisting that fandom is somehow a “teen girl” thing that older people should butt out of need to think about why the mainstream media constantly represents fan activities as the province of only teen girls. Hint: it’s because the culture thinks anything teen girls like or do is garbage. If you’re trying to shame someone over 25 for being involved in fandom, you’re probably participating in the cultural trashing of teen girl culture as something to be grown out of, something embarrassing that nobody should want to be involved in. You may want to rethink that.

The Buffy online fandom from 1997-2000 was almost entirely adults because we were the ones who had computers and internet access. The Bronze posting board had about half a dozen under-18 posters (that we knew of) and everyone was very protective of them. There were community rules during the day that were intended to keep the board’s discussions PG to ensure the younger fans would be comfortable and safe. And one of our biggest pet peeves was media critics talking about the show being “for teenagers” since all of us were adults who were the biggest fans.

[fahbee]:

Do these tumblr tweens and teens think that everyone just grows out of being a fan of things? And/or that those older fans shouldn’t be allowed a place at the table? Who the hell do they think makes the very media they consume and fan over? Peter Jackson is a fan boy. Steven Moffat is a fan boy. Josh Whedon is a fan boy. JJ Abrams is a fan boy. They didn’t grow out of it. They not only have a place at the table, they restored that fucking table, and added the expansion where your ungrateful teenage ass now sits. It is beyond ridiculous that young fans would push for the ouster of fans that have made up the fandom since before those young fans were even born. “Hey you, Star Wars fan since the day you sat in a movie theater in 1977, you are a sad, old, 50 year-old loser, why are you still in this fandom, don’t you know these new Star Wars sequels are for those of us who were literally shitting our diapers when The Phantom Menace was released?”

And this “debate” over the xfiles fandom is absurd. That some young people love the show today does not change the fact that it was made for an adult audience, and that the vast majority of its fandom today consists of people who were adults when it first aired in 1993.

[aleegrrl]:

I’ve seen this come up a few times in a few different fandoms and it always breaks my heart a little. I was about 17 when I first got into fandom online and some of my earliest fandom loves (DueSouth, Kung Fu: The Legend Continues, The Sentinel) were filled with folks of all ages. I loved the perspective I could gain by chatting with those much older than me, and they in turn seemed to enjoy the exuberance of the younger members. As I’ve grown older (I’m now 35) I’ve continued to enjoy the diversity that can exist in fandom as a whole.

It’s okay if you want to create spaces within fandom that are for specific age groups or demographics. Sometimes that’s the only way people feel safe spreading their wings and interacting with others. But as others have pointed out, fandom is not an age based hobby, it is a subculture. And the wonderful thing about diverse subcultures is how much we all gain from that diversity, which is why anytime I hear about one group trying to claim another should be part of fandom it just breaks my heart.

[obsessionisaperfume]:

I think it’s hysterical that anybody thinks they can turf out people who’ve been in fandom for over twenty years.

That’s like trying to push an Easter Island moai over on its side.

[filthybonnet]:

I remember being that sole teenager in the Law & Order fandom in the late 90s/early 00s. I remember feeling honored that these adults would actually let me on their listserv and chatrooms. They sometimes teased me longingly about it but they kind of took me under their wing and would talk to me about actual life things as well.

I now find myself on the other side of that conversation in fandom these days. However there seems to be more teenagers and fewer adults.

[dendritic-trees]:

I have to say, I came into fandom via my peers, so I’ve only really recently started to really interact with other fans in mixed-age spaces (I’m 25 for reference). And it is a revelation. Its amazing. Why, why would anyone try to segregate it?

[athenadark]:

I am a second generation fangirl, and I sit with my mom (who named me for the original Battlestar galactica] to watch marvel movies, she’s coming up to retirement age and she has a loot crate subscription for crap for her desk, so batman figures and terminator figures etc. yuo don’t grow out of fandom, you grow old with it.

[KatieGeeks]:

I was 14 when the X-Files started (1993) and I didn’t watch it because it was too fucking creepy for me. I didn’t regularly start watching until like season 5. The one friend I had in high school who had watched it from the start, only started watching it because it was what her parents watched, and she ended up liking it.

Remember that in the early 90s, about a third of households in the U.S. only had one TV. And a lot of homes with more than one TV had only one “good TV.” You know, the one that was hooked up to cable rather than rabbit ears, or was bigger than 13 inches, or was in color. (Now more than half of households have at least 3 TVs, and it’s almost impossible to even buy something thatisn’t HD.) So if early-90s teens wanted to watch the “good TV,” we were usually watching what our parents wanted to watch (or else engaging in seriously complex negotiations). And yeah, we may have ended up liking things … but that didn’t mean they were made for us. Because network execs didn’t really care about making prime-time tv for teenagers the 90s. They made shows for adults, shows for families, and 90210. Because the thing is that even if you had two good TVs hooked up to cable, cable in the early 90s was not like cable now. And neither was Network TV. The X-Files had more than 12 million viewers a week in it’s first season and ranked in at the 105th most popular show. Today, 12 million viewers is good for #15. In 1993, Fox itself had only existed for about six year[s], had only had popular programming for about 4, and 1993 was the first year that they had prime-time programming every night of the week.The CW wouldn’t exist for more than a decade. It’s precursors UPN and the WB were still a couple years from debuting. And neither of them would be specifically targeting a youth market right away. UPN was seriously only initially built as a platform for Star Trek: Voyager and then pretty much split it’s focus between trying to get dudes to watch (Trek & The Sentinel (LOL, Nobody tell them) and WWE wrestling) and black-led sit-coms (Moesha, Malcom & Eddie, In the House, Girlfriends). It’s real move to “teen” was when it started picking up the WB’s cast-offs (Buffy, Roswell) and then got Veronica Mars. Meanwhile, The WB was initially heavily tilted toward the “urban” audience that Fox started abandoning with the cancellation of In Living Color… until they too abandoned them for the “White teens and twenty-somethings” market of Dawson’s, [Buffy, Felicity, Charmed, et al). Yes, the proliferation of cable and alternate screen and smaller and smaller niche programs has made it so that now plenty of media is made “for teenagers” or “for youth markets.” But… still not most of it.

Which logically means that most of fandom is also not specifically for teens or youth markets. Because fandom comes from the audience, and the audience can always be anyone.

[firespirited]:

I find it baffling too. WUT

I emerged onto the 56k internet at 16 to newsgroups, BBS, IRC and a few rare websites and was very aware of being in an adult playground. Any interesting places were run by adults with jobs or students with .edu addresses.

I lurked and learned the lingo for months before posting because the places that I belonged to could sniff out minors and “females”. I wasn’t part of any fandom so much as wanting to learn stuff so I didn’t encounter many of the older women who made fandom happen offline and online at the time.

The internet was built by adults* for adults*. Folks were either annoyed by teens or gently (or not so gently) mentoring them. The internet, like literature and movies still has an area designated adults only and no I’m not talking solely about porn. TV still has a little space for us (see my next tl;dr post).

*By adults: I mean responsible enough to put 18+ gateways on adult content, smart enough to engineer/tweak the code themselves and earning enough to pay the fees involved in having a website and being online so many hours. *By adults: I don’t mean drama-free, wise, sane and noble.

Pissing contests, flamewars and queen bee/top dog ambitions aren’t limited to youth or the internet. Book club, knitting circle or even bible study can become fight club in 10 seconds flat if enough tension has built up.This whole thing reminds me of those poor little teen goths and punks who are shocked, shocked I say, and very annoyed to find OLDS in their subculture! 30-60 year olds who just tone it down a little for work.

[drst]:

I had to watch Buffy on the crappy old tv in the basement. Bear in mind I was 24 at that point.

[thatgirlnevershutsup]:

Dear Tumblr babies, Not every thing is about you. I mean, The X-Files? Trust me, I watched the show on Fox as it aired (with commercials and everything!) and was there on atxf and atxc. The fandom, while it had teenage fans, was never ever a “space for teens.” No love,

Snacky (who is old enough to be your mother) (and who knows, maybe I am, and if so, get the hell off the computer and empty the dishwasher like I’ve told you to do ten times already, ffs!)

[sharkdazzler]:

If you skimmed this, check out the link at the bottom under the cut, at least, for some interesting numbers about Tumblr demographics. I’ve always been confused by people feeling “old” on Tumblr over 25. Those stats reflect my experience that, more often than not, you’re talking to someone between 25 and 40 here. It makes sense, when you remember what a MASSIVE generation the echo boom produced. So many portable classrooms. The more time passes, the more I’m convinced that the above points about female aging and age panic has created a strange, closet majority online. We were raised to fetishize our own youth in a bizarrely narrow time frame. 17? Culturally relevant! 22? Life is just beginning! 25? Getting old. 28? CRONE. 30? Dead. Enjoy your 8 years as a semi-relevant human, ladies. That’s a whole 1/10 of your actual life expectancy. Neat. I still miss the old internet, when everyone was 10-20 years older than me. Not because I was younger, but because it really WAS nicer. So many of those old mailing lists would fall into hate-fueled chaos if they were started now. Fandoms are BETTER with age diversity. It helps keep the hormonal monsters in check, and reminds the younger ones that age isn’t actually a disease. It’s sad that anyone would try to wreck that.

[unnumberedtomorrows]:

I was 16 when we my parents got a pc. I’d already been an avid xphile for three seasons and so it was my first online fandom (good times). Even at 14 when i started watching it I was never under the illusion that it was aimed at my demographic. I think it’s great that one of my oldest fandoms is getting an influx of new fans, but if you cant play nice then you can get off my damn lawn. Fandom belongs to no single group, it is collaborative and it will always remain so.

[rhiannaellen]:

I certainly don’t speak for all teenagers, but I actually love having the generations before me in the same fandoms. I like discussing shows and movies with you all. The only reason I ever got into The X-Files or Stargate is because the older people I follow on tumblr showed me these amazing shows (that I’m now obsessed with). I love seeing older generations being passionate about fandoms, because I know that will be me in. I’ve read fanfiction from 2004. Fanfiction written when I was 7! (Which is really cool!) I appreciate it all. And I thank you all for paving the way and for being an example of what a kind loving fandom should look like. So please stay. Stay forever. Because you all are my favorites!

[vaspider]:

Interesting facts, entirely aside from the long portion of the post, but which I think are important to the central idea of ‘fandom as youth space’:The word “fandom” is ninety-plus years old. It originated with the original science fiction pulps. It was invented by people who were born in the nineteenth century, okay? The word “egoboo” is over eighty years old. It, too, came from the original science fiction pulps. Some of the most influential science fiction fanzines (yes, that word is older than your grandmother too) came from POC in New York. POC/WOC have been central to science fiction and fandom from the beginning.

The idea that “old people” don’t belong in fandom, especially science fiction fandom (which X-Files most certainly is) is fucking bizarre. The idea that “old people” don’t belong in Transformers fandom is especially bizarre to me (though I’m not in that fandom) because I owned Transformers growing up, and I have two kids who are teenaged or pre-teen.

[villainny]:

I got a D in my IT GCSE because it was before they started blocking things on school computers and I spent all my lessons reading (and writing) Mulder/Krycek porn. I was 13 when I started in the fandom, and literally everyone I knew was older than me; I didn’t post my first fic online until I was 18 because of all the warnings and such on the yahoo groups mailing lists.

I love the excitement and energy of people getting into fandom for the first time, but the whole deal of fandom has always been collaboration, cooperation, support, sharing, so don’t tell anyone else to get off your lawn.

Seriously, the BEST THING about fandom is the levelling. It is not and should not be weird to have friends who are twice your age, or half your age; the best friendships are about shared experiences and the ability to learn from each other.

[voelliglosgeloest]:

I’ve actually been thinking about fandom and age a lot lately - partially because I am An Old now, but also because I was rereading the Msscribe saga and thought “god, for all they’re acting like childish morons, they’re really presenting themselves as adults, aren’t they?” In who everyone was/was pretending to be - professionals with jobs and kids - and in the language, it was a much more adult conception of fandom. Which is what I remember from my own early-Internet teen days, where you totally had to pretend to be over 18 even though you were 13. If MsScribe went down these days you know she’d be “16″.

basically, there’s no place for older women in society, and the one place they had apparently isn’t theirs any more either.

[notwiselybuttoowell]:

As with most things I like, where I tend to lone wolf it and not really engage with group consumption of the material, I’ve been outside of the x-files nexus and missed the start of and a lot content of this issue, but from what I’m seeing, the extremes of this blowup seem (from this observer position ) to have a lot to do the concept of fandom “ownership”. Which seems to be a big problem in fandoms in general. Fandom is a subculture, but in a lot of ways it’s a subsidiary of the material too. I’m not saying it’s not without value for a lot of people, but I think as an amorphous, secondary thing, a loosening of the reins is a beneficial thing at any given time for any given party within one.

[daskum]:

I was a teen when I started to watch XF, and I have such fond memories of the fandom back them. It was a kinder place, I think. Even the wank was nicer. And as it’s been mentioned people in general were older, but they were welcoming, warm and talented, and basically amazing role models of how I wanted to be when I grew older. I think my 16-year-old-self found it cool as fuck that you could be a functioning [awesome] adult and still be *so* into a TV show. I mean, they were the ones that could afford the merchandise, and go on weekends (Scullyfic Spring training!) with other fans and spend the whole time watching episodes and talking about them and writing amazing fics. It was the dream.

I feel like I learned so much from just lurking there, it baffles me people now wouldn’t want to “share” the fandom (in as much as it’s theirs to share, that is) with older fans.

[btwinlines]:

As my sub header says, I’m an old fan eager to learn. But as much as I love learning from younger people, I love teaching them what I experienced. You know the whole “been there, done that” we learnt by heart 22 years ago thanks to X-Files. Come on, people, we are all on the same boat here, let’s have fun!

[fanonisbetterthancanon]:

I started watching the X-Files when I was 6 years old because my mom loved it. My entire family watched it together, but it was because my mom made sure we were all home by Friday and then Sunday nights to watch. If we couldn’t watch it when it aired, my mom had me or my brother setup the VCR to record.

My mom was definitely in the fandom at this time. We got a computer with dial-up internet when I was in 2nd grade. So… 1996? She was obsessed with Krycek. Talked after every episode she want online to X-Files fansites. I know this because our computer was in the living room and I could always see the X-Files logo and a steamy photo of Nicholas Lea on the banner. Though she’s never come right out and said it, I am 100% convinced she was reading and possibly writing fanfiction at this time.

So, the idea that this and pretty much every other fandom in existence isn’t run by middle-aged mothers using the computer after their kids go to bed? Completely foreign to me.

[vulgarweed]:

Ye gods. X-Files fanfic wasn’t the first fic I ever read, but it was the first fic I read on the internet (as opposed to zines). That’s because Gossamer and other X-Files archives coincided with about the first time I had regular internet access in the mid-90s.

Which I had because of my job at a newspaper, not at home. I was in my mid-20s at the time. Loved the show, watched it religiously.

Still here in fandom, not going anywhere anytime soon. Don’t like it? Too bad for you.

[ravenmorganleigh]:

I know a woman who has got to be about 70 by now – who has lent an amazing amount of support to the Starsky and Hutch Fandom for DECADES. That was my first fandom, then X-Files, and BtVS, and Angel, and now Sherlock and Sleepy Hollow. All of a sudden, I find I’m no longer welcome—because of my age??? What the hell is that about? It bothers me more, because a lot of youth culture appropriates what came decades before it – without acknowledging where it came from, and behaving as if older folks in fandom are sort of like a dead culture to be plundered. Sort of like Hard Core Punk. :-)

[vulgarweed]:

I would have a LITTLE more sympathy for this perspective if it was a show actually aimed at kids - I do understand why people get upset about, say, the proliferation of My Little Pony porn that’s not well-tagged or warned or firewalled and makes it unsafe for actual children to search for a fandom that really is for them - but the X-Files? That’s like being upset that Game of Thrones fandom is unsafe for kids. (Not that X-Files has that much sex, rape, and gratuitous nudity, but it is definitely a scary, violent show with adult themes and no kid characters, that was not and never has been marketed to teens or children.) Guess what, adults get to have things WE like too. Teen fans are welcome, but if they’re going to try to claim that a fandom for a show aimed at adults that first aired 22 years ago, with a LOT of original fans still around, belongs to them only? hahahahah NOPE. Online fandom is a multi-generational space - it always has been and it always will be. That’s one of its good qualities. I’m in my 40s and I love hearing the fandom stories of people who are older even than me, that’s part of what I’m here for. People who can’t cope with that are the ones who should get out of fandom, IMO.

Comments in Other Posts

[olderthannetfic]:

Baby’s First Fandom:

Oh my god, tumblr, did I hear right that there’s drama about The X-Files being a “show for teens”? That makes me laugh so hard. X-Files was my very first fandom, back when I was 13 and it had only been on half a season. (That’s the spring of 1994, for the history challenged.)

At the time, there was constant disapproving clucking on the newsgroup over the idea that ~a child~ might be allowed to watch a violent, scary, dark, adult show like The X-Files. I know everybody watches heads getting chopped off on HBO now, but it wasn’t so in 1994. That was some edgy, dark entertainment, yo! It was most certainly aimed at adults.

It had the fandom to match: a few college students, but mostly a lot of people who were older and out of school. If I’m 34 now, all of them must be in their 40s at the very least.

X-Files was the fandom that pioneered the massive, single-fandom fic archive. (Theirs predates FFN.) It was one of the earlier fandoms to have organized vidding spaces online. I wasn’t that aware of that stuff since I entered high school and got busy with non-fandom things, but the adults were there, organizing and building, just like they are in most fandoms.

It’s also where little baby me heard about the concept of bisexuality. (My parents were quite liberal but quite 1960s. Gay stuff, they got. Bisexuality… not so much.) I read somebody’s post about getting twice the enjoyment out of The X-Files and a lightbulb went on. Just one of the many educational things about that fandom! (I came out when I was 14, in fact. It’s not in my sidebar because, once you’ve been out for two decades, it’s not the self-description that springs first to mind.)

Back then, on the 90s internet, it was normal to shun the fuck out of anybody underage, either because they were annoying or for ~think of the children~ reasons. I’m grateful that not everyone did. A lot of people in fandom were still willing to engage me in critical discussions and listen to what I had to say, even though I was very public about being 13. And that’s why, today, I have no ageist policy of avoiding teenagers on Tumblr. Follow me if you want. Talk to me if you want. Don’t if you don’t want. Whatever.

Your life isn’t over at 20 or 30 or any age. Fandom isn’t something you need to outgrow. I hope you’re all still here in two decades, reminiscing about X-Files fandom on Tumblr, just like I am about X-Files fandom on Usenet.

Some Excerpts from the Series of Posts To Which This Was a Response

The debate may have been influenced by the perception of some fans that both the X-Files show and the fandom contained transphobic elements.

screenshot of a tumblr post by Elizabeth, early September 2015

It is clear that for some fans, the issue of relative age had been circulating in the X Files fandom, as evidenced by this post, with the text:

so anyway i found my moms xfiles fanfiction from the 90's. cant wait for when this exact same thing will happen to current fanfic writers.

[anonymous ask and reply by totalpunk]:

Anonymous asked: Yo what don't u like about the x files fandom? The only divide is like old vs young fans and it's only bc some of the older fans look down on the younger ones and have said some weird homophobic transphobic shit

tbh I actually don’t want to list my grievances with the fandom due to it’s clique-y nature and the love of call out posts. It’s really anxiety-inducing for me.

It’s a case of I love the show, its a huge part of my life but the fandom seems a) overly dramatic and b) not something I can relate to. So I’m a lot more comfortable in the sw fandom, hence why I’m on this blog more often.

[goingrampant]:

I never really watched The X-Files during its time. I saw a few episodes, but they totally creeped me out, and I avoided them. Now, I get creeped out by Supernatural and am too jaded to react strongly to X-Files, and I've started watching the series via Netflix streaming. The stories are entertaining enough, but there are some annoying themes. One of them is a transphobic plotline in the thirteenth (fourteenth if you count the pilot) episode "Gender Bender", in which an androgynous shapeshifting humanoid alien goes on a sexual killing spree.

[dashakay]:

As a queer woman who remembers all too well how ridiculously homophobic X-Files fandom could be back in the day (let’s not even discuss the time I came out on Haven because it was awful), I don’t want my blog to ever be a place where queer and trans people feel unsafe. Ever. I also don’t want to make queer and trans people feel unsafe by ignoring this issue.

Further reading

• a historical note
• Why It Is Not Surprising That There Are Old People On Tumblr, and Why We Are Surprised By It Anyway
• Fandom Wank, ^{Archived version}, September 2015 discussion on Fail-Fandomanon