MinecraftFan (talk) 10:46, 28 January 2019 (UTC)
Hi JKFAN, you've been doing a lot of editing, which is great. I have one small request, when you do a small edit, like adding a wiki link, can you please check the box that says this is a minor edit. It just makes it easier for me and others, because we can filter out the minor edits on the Recent changes page. Thank you, and keep up the good work. -- Kingstoken (talk) 16:13, 21 January 2019 (UTC)
- Hi again, JKFAN, I would also really appreciate it if you would mark your small edits minor. I don't always have time to check Fanlore every day and it can be really hard to catch up on things if I can't filter out small edits on the recent changes page. - Hoopla (talk) 05:34, 26 January 2019 (UTC)
Please use the "This is a minor edit" feature
Hi, JKFAN, it's me one more time. I notice you've been very industrious. Thanks for doing all those default sorts especially! Listen, I realize you're pretty new and both of these comments above didn't give you a whole lot of information, so I'm commenting here on your talk page again with more information in hopes of helping you understand why it's important to a lot of Fanlore regulars that you mark your edits as minor. I hope if you have any questions or concerns you'll reply here. Since you replied to one of my talk page comments on my userpage earlier this week, I think you may also find Wikipedia:Help:Talk pages useful. There's a short video introduction on that page as well as lots more details in case you need them — Fanlore uses the same kind of wiki as Wikipedia, and follows a good deal of its practices, including using talk pages in the way described on that page. (Or at least, everything above the "Notifications" section.)
Moving on to minor edits, here's what I hope I can help you to understand: because you are not marking your small edits as minor edits, you're actively making it harder for me to use Fanlore and contribute to it. This is probably true for other users as well. I know you're not doing it on purpose, and that you probably don't even realize why it's a problem, so please stick with me as I explain.
There are a few ways to keep track of edits on Fanlore:
- Special:RecentChanges shows all edits across the whole wiki, including talk pages, picture uploads, user creation, etc.
- Special:Watchlist shows a user just the pages that they've "watched", meaning pages they're interested in keeping track of. Some people watch all pages they edit, other people use different criteria.
- In addition to being able to view their watchlist on the wiki, many users will get an email any time a page on their watchlist is edited, depending on how they've adjusted their preferences.
I don't know which of these, if any, you use. Maybe you do something else! But the point is, when you edit a page, other people see that you've edited that page. If you edit a lot of pages, people will see that, too.
Let's say you fix 30 pages up with DEFAULTSORT so that they correctly display in lists. That's great! That's exactly the kind of minor edit I appreciate. However: changing how the page is listed is not a content change, and it's a really small edit. No one is going to look at all 30 of those pages once they've checked one and seen that it's DEFAULTSORT. In fact, if you put "DEFAULTSORT" or something in the edit summary field, no one will even have to click through to the page to find out what you changed. And that's good! Small edits like fixing typos, adding categories, adding internal links (if you don't change the phrasing), changing the default sort, etc, are... minor edits. They're important to the wiki, but they don't change the page.
Think about this: every time you edit a page, someone is probably getting an email. Every time you edit a page, that's another entry on the Recent Changes page and on someone's Watchlist. If you mark your minor edits as minor, two things happen:
- Less emails will be sent out because the standard settings, which I assume most users use, don't send emails for minor edits. People who want that have to opt-in on their preferences page.
- People using the Recent Changes page or viewing their watchlist can filter out the edit using the "hide minor edits" option so that they can see just the big changes to pages.
Obviously I can't speak for everyone, but I depend on my watchlist, emails, and the Recent Changes page to keep track of things on the wiki that I'm invested in and to check up on what everyone else is doing to see if I can help. Not only do I not want an email every time someone adds an internal link on a page I watch, but also I need to be able to filter out that kind of edit on the Recent Changes page if I miss several days or even a week of being on the site if I want to contribute to Fanlore as best as I am able, because a flood of small edits that change nothing about the page make it very hard to find the edits that do matter.
I cannot filter you out by username. I cannot filter out changes by size of information added or removed. I cannot just stick to my watchlist or emails because A) lots of small-edits-that-should-be-marked-as-minor will drown out bigger edits there, too, and B) other people frequently edit or create pages I am not watching that I am interested in. The little checkbox that says "This is a minor edit" on every edit page was literally made to solve this problem, and I cannot overstate how much I would love if you would use it so that the Recent Changes page isn't overwhelmed by tiny corrections that keep the page from being useful.
Clicking the checkbox every time when you're going to make a lot of minor edits all at once can be annoying, and I sympathize, but Fanlore has a great fix for that as well. If you go to Special:Preferences and look under the "Editing" tab, there is a checkbox that says "Mark all edits minor by default". I go in and check this box whenever I know I'm going to make a lot of small edits to save myself some time, and it works wonders. Since you make a lot of small edits all at once, maybe you'll find it useful too.
I hope I've explained this problem to you at enough length so that you can understand why we've been asking you to mark your edits as minor. Thank you for your time, and please feel free to comment below with any questions. — Hoopla (talk) 18:30, 2 February 2019 (UTC)
Changing phrasing in quotes.
Hi, JKFAN. I can see you're really enthusiastic about the wiki but you've changed the phrasing people have used in quotes a bunch of times and we really don't do that. Many of the phrasings you've changed were links that already went to the right place because there are redirects in place, too. Anyway, please stop doing that and like Kingstoken said above it would be great if you could mark your future small edits as minor. Thanks. Hoopla (talk) 03:13, 23 January 2019 (UTC)
Hi, JKFAN, me again. I wanted to draw your attention to two related problems. I've noticed that often when you're changing internal links you stick very strictly to the Fanlore page title, for example changing "preslash" to "Pre-slash".
The first problem that with this is that we don't automatically capitalize internal links. Page names are capitalized because they're page titles, but capitalization should follow normal English grammar rules. I've noticed you don't seem to like redirects for some reason, but I promise you that you can just leave things without capitalization and let the redirects handle it and it will be fine. If the internal link is a red link because the redirect hasn't been created, it'd actually be really helpful for you to create the redirect instead of changing the link.
The second problem is that Fanlore page titles are supposed to be descriptivist, not prescriptivist. What I mean is, when fandom has several ways of spelling a word, it's really not up to Fanlore to decide which of those spellings is correct. We try to pick the most popular one for the page title, but that doesn't make other spellings less legitimate. When you meticulously go through and change all of one way of spelling a word (like "preslash") to match the Fanlore page title ("pre-slash") it feels... kind of judgey, and definitely nitpicky. As early as 2008, Fanlore policy has been to be consistent in individual articles, not across the site, and I'd hate to see you waste your time fixing so many things that are actually just fine as they are. - Hoopla (talk) 05:34, 26 January 2019 (UTC)
Slow Boat to Bespin: NSFW Link
Hi, JKFAN! First off, welcome to Fanlore - we're really glad to have you with us. Thank you for all your contributions so far!!
I just wanted to leave a quick note about the link that you added to the Slow Boat to Bespin page, regarding whether Carrie Fisher has had a nude scene on film. Fanlore is focused on fan-created works and activities, and it's always important to evaluate carefully the need to get into intimate details regarding any celebrity's personal life. In this case, since adding background related to Fisher's detailed appearances or lack thereof doesn't give any additional information regarding the fanwork, and considering that explicit fanart has never restricted itself to subjects with previous nude appearances in any fandom, we (the Fanlore Committee) decided it would be best to remove the link.
If you have any questions about this decision, please do get in touch by leaving a note here or on my Talk page. Again, we're really pleased to have you editing Fanlore, and we're happy to give any editing tips or advice that you need as you familiarise yourself with the wiki.
Have a great weekend! enchantedsleeper, 10:03, 26 January 2019 (UTC)
Links to Categories
I've noticed that you're removing a lot of links that lead to categories, particularly links for years. There's nothing incorrect about a link leading to a category, so I've had to undo a lot of your edits. Please stop removing links to years. –caes (talk) 23:31, 4 February 2019 (UTC)
I noticed you removed a bunch of links to Alien with the justification that it was a redirect to a disambiguation page. Although links to the correct article are best, there is nothing wrong with linking to disambiguation pages. The person who clicks on the link can still navigate to the page they want in two clicks instead of one. But removing the link entirely means the reader won't go to the page at all.--aethel (talk) 03:01, 5 February 2019 (UTC)
- JKFAN, I see that you're changing links like CBS and TNT to TV Channels, but these individual channel links already redirect to their subsection on the TV Channels. e.g. the CBS page contains "#redirect TV Channels#CBS ," so the link leads directly to the CBS section, not the top of the page. I'm undoing a bunch of your edits because of this. And as other people have already said, it's helpful if you mark edits that are less than a sentence as minor edits. – caes (talk) 02:50, 12 February 2019 (UTC)
- JKFAN, +1. It's actually unhelpful for you to remove those links because if someone does come up with enough relevant information in the future to make a CBS & Fandom page, it will be that much more work to make all the existing CBS links go to the right place. Plus, there's nothing wrong with redirects. And yes, again, it would still be really helpful if you would mark your small edits as minor. Again, if you have any questions about wikilinks or minor edits, I would be happy to answer them. - Hoopla (talk) 02:56, 12 February 2019 (UTC)
We appreciate your continued contributions to Fanlore. However, for some time you have been engaging in editing behaviour which is damaging to the wiki and frustrating to other editors who are also using Fanlore. As such, we have issued a three-day suspension according to our Hostile Editing policy.
As multiple editors have already advised you, removing or changing mass amounts of existing internal links on the wiki is not helpful behaviour, as it removes the connections between pages that Fanlore depends on to be a useful resource, and does not add anything to the wiki.
Once your suspension is lifted, please consider making more constructive edits such as creating new pages, adding content to existing pages, or adding new internal links. We would be happy to issue editing advice if you need help. Please remember going forward that engaging productively with other editors and taking into account feedback you receive is an important aspect of being part of our community in Fanlore.
If you continue to engage in hostile editing behaviour we won't hesitate to issue a longer suspension or a permanent ban. If you have any questions, please use the Contact Us form and select "Other" as your subject to contact the Fanlore Committee.
In this edit to the Elrond page you changed
[http://www.libraryofmoria.com/a/viewstory.php?sid=1865&chapter=1 Erestor and Elrond] by [[EW]] to
[http://www.libraryofmoria.com/a/viewstory.php?sid=1865&chapter=1 Erestor and Elrond] by EW with the edit note, "EW in this case has nothing to do with Entertainment Weekly." and you need to quit making this kind of edit. Since you were literally looking at a case of EW being used to refer to something besides Entertainment Weekly, something that's probably common because I've definitely never had anyone shorten the magazine's name to EW, you could clearly see that disambiguation would be needed. Furthermore, it's obvious from the kinds of edits you've made previously that you know how to use the "What links here" function, and that Elrond page link was the only thing directed at EW, which means deleteing the link on the Elrond page and creating the redirect was not only bad editing but also useless. Stop removing links. - Hoopla (talk) 21:42, 16 February 2019 (UTC)
As you continue to edit Fanlore, please be mindful of the following issues with your recent edits as identified by other editors:
- Creating pages that are not primarily about topics related to fanworks and fan communities
- Removing internal links to disambiguation pages without also adding a relevant, specific link
- Editing internal links to match article page capitalization instead of adhering to conventional grammar
- Removing links to categories
- Changing quoted language
Many of these edits are in violation of our policies, and create additional work for other editors. If you continue to make edits that violate our policies, we will issue another temporary suspension; repeated violations may result in a permanent ban. Going forward, we also encourage you to respond to messages left by other editors on your talk page; open communication amongst editors is key to Fanlore's continued growth.
To find out how to display it on your user page, check out these instructions: How can I display my badges on Fanlore?
When you upload an image, please also provide information about who created it, when it was created, and where you found it (if you found it online, please include the URL). Fanlore has an image policy you can read up on here: Fanlore:Image Policy. If there's ever a doubt about whether an image file should stay on Fanlore, the image will be more likely to be deleted if no one can figure out who made it and why. There are also copyright concerns that can be alleviated by providing more context for why an image should be allowed to stay.--aethel (talk) 23:51, 3 March 2019 (UTC)
BTW date categories don't belong on fandom overview pages. The focus of a fandom page should be the fandom itself and not the canon it's based on (if any). Dates especially don't make sense for RPF because the people live for decades (one hopes), and the RPF fandom doesn't always correspond to their lifespan (see Historical RPF). We do include dates on pages about websites, fanworks, various fan forums, conventions and other events. There is a help page on what categories to put where: Help:Categorising Guidelines.--aethel (talk) 14:37, 9 March 2019 (UTC)
JKFAN, I noticed that you were changing links from crack vid to Crack. I'm assuming this is because crack vid is currently a redirect to Crack and is discussed on that page. However, this type of change is unnecessary as clicking on crack vid already takes the reader where they want to go. Worse, if we ever split out crack vid to its own page, we'd have to go back and undo all the links to crack. In conclusion it's really not worth the time spent to change links that already go to the right place. See Talk:Papa Don't Preach.--aethel (talk) 02:58, 12 March 2019 (UTC)
Hi, JKFAN, it's me again, here to talk to you about your recent edits to a bunch of pages by adding on to aethel's note above. I think that aethal's comment to you was plenty clear about what you should stop doing and why, honestly, but maybe you were confused? I'll try again with more explanation, however.
Linking to Werewolf is not more correct than linking to Werewolf AU and you are not fixing anything by doing so. You are actively making the wiki's organization worse, as aethal tried to explain to you. At some point, someone is going to want to make a proper Werewolf AU page, separate from Werewolf, the way I somewhat recently separated Vampire AU from Vampire. By changing all of the
[[Werewolf AU]] links to
[[Werewolf|Werewolf AU]] you are preventing the future Werewolf AU page from being well-linked on all the pages it needs to be linked on.
And just to be clear, this is only one reason not to change redirect links. There are a lot more reasons not to change links to avoid redirects, and you can and should read about them here on wikipedia.
...Furthermore, I know it probably doesn't feel good to have us constantly telling you that you're doing things wrong, and I know that this note from me in particular is probably coming off as really irritated with you, but it's hard not to feel like you're deliberately ignoring us when you don't reply to messages on your talk page or even change your behavior, so I feel the need to be blunt and direct with you. When we come to your talk page to tell you to stop doing something because it's unproductive, we're trying to help you join our community, become a good editor, and (especially in this case) not waste your valuable time fixing things that aren't broken. The very least you could do is acknowledge our comments and ask follow up questions if you don't understand why you're being asked to stop doing something. I shouldn't have to write you a short essay to get you to adhere to good editing practices when aethal's comment was perfectly fine. Please do better in the future. - Hoopla (talk) 22:23, 8 April 2019 (UTC)
- Yeah, please don't waste time with edits like these. Changing
[[Unauthorized Sequel]]sis absolutely pointless.--Assassin J (talk) 02:08, 9 April 2019 (UTC)
- @JKFAN - Do you read your talk page? Why are you still doing this? There are MUCH more useful things you can put effort into instead of changing every single "head canon" into "headcanon" and every single "panfandom" into "Pan-fandom" and every single "Mudblood" into "Blood Status|Mudblood"! --Assassin J (talk) 18:44, 9 April 2019 (UTC)
- As discussed in the wikipedia link I provided above, and as I've stated elsewhere on this page, all of those edits are actually damaging to the wiki:
- First, "headcanon" isn't more correct then "head canon", and "pan-fandom" (or "Pan-fandom"!) isn't more correct than "panfandom". It's all fannish slang, it's all legitimate.
- Second, we try to name pages based on which usage is most frequent. We might some day find that, say, 80% of the wiki links on our wiki use "head canon" instead of "headcanon" and switch which is the page and which is the redirect... but we can't make that kind of judgement if the redirects aren't used!
- Third, as discussed above in detail TWICE in this very section, just because there's not a "Mudblood" page now doesn't mean there won't be one later, at which point we will need those wiki links.
This edit: Changing the link from "Grindhouse works at AO3" to just "AO3" is really not helpful. The general style used across Fanlore is the descriptive "XYZ Works at Site", not just "Site".
This edit: I get what you were trying to do but in the process you messed up the Tumblr link. Also,
[http://www.tumblr.com/tagged/fuck+you+she%27s+awesome fuck you she's awesome tag on Tumblr is essentially the same as
[http://www.tumblr.com/tagged/fuck+you+she%27s+awesome fuck you she's awesome] tag on [[Tumblr]]. Maybe one could argue that linking to the Tumblr or Dreamwidth or AO3 article is pointless because everyone knows what those are? But what if someone doesn't know what those are? Maybe it's worth a discussion about it. What are your thoughts?--Assassin J (talk) 22:51, 8 April 2019 (UTC)
- I always wikilink those sites (once per fanlore page) if it's convenient. In addition to your reasons, Assassin J, people surf into fanlore from google or a blog link and may not know what pages are available beyond whatever page they landed on.--aethel (talk) 00:29, 9 April 2019 (UTC)
- Additionally, using
[http://link.com XYZ Works] at Sitemakes it easier to add two different links from the same site, if need be. For example, if people were using both "fuck you she's awesome" and "frick you she's awesome" frequently on tumblr, you would want to list both of those, as "fuck you she's awesome at tumblr" and "frick you she's awesome at tumblr". - Hoopla (talk) 02:34, 9 April 2019 (UTC)
- Additionally, using
You're using date categories wrong, which you have been told before.
Stop putting date categories on fandom pages. They also don't belong on character pages or RPF pages. It's wrong. That's not how the wiki works. This was explained to you here and you were linked to this page that includes this section on date categories. Read your own talk page and read the help article. It's unfair for us to have to follow after you fixing mistakes you should have stopped making already.
I will also take this moment to remind you that grandparent categories don't need to be added to pages. If you don't know what that means, I assume you will figure out how to use your own talk page and ask me for clarification. - Hoopla (talk) 01:31, 11 April 2019 (UTC)
This message is to inform you that you have been found in violation of Fanlore's Hostile Editing Policy once again. Many of your recent edits have negatively impacted the wiki by making it more difficult for other users to navigate. In accordance with our policies, your account will be suspended for two weeks.
The other members of our community have already tried their best to explain to you why changing and redirecting large numbers of internal links is damaging to the wiki. We are concerned to see that you have continued to ignore your fellow editors as they attempt to communicate their issues with your recent edits.
This is your final warning. Once your suspension is lifted, if you continue to engage in editing behaviour of this kind, we will be issuing a permanent ban.
If you want to continue editing Fanlore, you must be willing to communicate and co-operate with your fellow editors, particularly when they are taking the time to explain why we have the policies and practices that we do. If you have any questions about this, please don't hesitate to email us via the contact form.
STOP DOING THESE THINGS
JKFAN, I've just spent about an hour of time I'll never get back removing lyrics, dialogues, and stray comments from the pages you've created as well as removing official logos and such (find fanart to use instead and stop using promotional thumbnails.) I've taken out extensive canon, added "Needs Citation" to vague, general statements, and I've found far too many things you've put on pages, such as "BONG!" and ""Fanlore.org will REST...IN...PEACE!"" from this page, and ""If you smelllllll what THE ROCK is COOKING!"" from this page. I'm sure there are plenty other "funny" little Easter eggs that will take a long time to find and remove. Not only is this wasted time, energy, and attention, but I consider it vandalism. --MPH (talk) 19:17, 5 May 2019 (UTC)
- More shenanigans, more vandalism:
- ""RIGHT HERE, ON FANLORE.ORG!" (Thumbs up, cheap pop)" and ""Have a nice day!"" from this page.
- ""Ladies and gentlemen, my name is Paul Heyman and this is my Fanlore page."" from this page.
- ""Live, from Fanlore.org, it's Saturday Night!"" and ""Good night, and have a pleasant tomorrow."" from this page.
- ""I find your lack of fannishness disturbing"" from this page --MPH (talk) 19:42, 5 May 2019 (UTC)