Once Upon a Time... Is Now/Issues 033-034
| Zine | |
|---|---|
| Title: | Once Upon a Time... Is Now (Out-In, Out/In, Out...In) |
| Publisher: | |
| Editor(s): | Jeanne Cloud and Joyce DeBoard (issues #1-#27), Jeanne Cloud, Loreen Vanderkrats, and Linda Lakin (issues #27-#33 -- tho perhaps as far as #45), Jeanne Cloud and Loreen Vanderkrats (issues #46-#60 -- tho perhaps as early as #34) |
| Type: | letterzine |
| Date(s): | 1988 to 1996 |
| Frequency: | sometimes monthly, sometimes bi-monthly, at the end much more infrequent |
| Medium: | |
| Size: | digest-sized |
| Fandom: | Beauty and the Beast (TV) |
| Language: | English |
| External Links: | |
| Click here for related articles on Fanlore. | |
Once Upon a Time... Is Now (Out-In, Out/In, Out...In) is a Beauty and the Beast letterzine. It is digest-sized.
See List of Letterzines for similar fanworks.
Contents
The zine is a collection of letters from fans (titled "From the Helpers") of the show discussing aspects of the show including the actors, characters, stories, and fanfiction. This zine also contains photos (both xeroxed and original), some original artwork, con reports, open letters, and sometimes clippings and interviews.
Some regular features were: "OK Good...OK Fine" (the editorial), "From the Library" (zine listings), and "On the Pipes" (fan clubs).
There were 60 issues published between 1988 to 1996.
Issue 33
Once Upon a Time... Is Now 33 was published in July 1991 and contains 32 pages.
This issue contains photos and con reports from South of Oz.
This issue contains a photo of cosplayer, Tom Brecht as "Vincent Wells."
From the editorial:
Boy, I don't know about you guys, but I'm pooped after the frantic pace of the conventions the last month or so. First there was the wonderful cruise, then the Chicago fiasco, then South of Oz.
For those of you who got caught short on the PROSTAR convention in Chicago June 1 & 2, you have my sympathies. I was too. Jackie Paciello and I had been working with these jerks for several months trying to do the internal programming for the convention. No, we weren't organizing the con - just arranging the panels, talks, autograph line, etc. The convention was cancelled just three days before it was scheduled. We found out by accident. They didn't even have the decency to call and tell us. I worked for three days trying to help stranded fans who had non-refundable tickets and couldn't get home. If any of you have any Southwest tickets, we have worked out a deal for a travel voucher for the full amount. Send me a self-addressed stamped envelope and I'll send you the documentation you will need and the address for your refund. News has it that they have rescheduled the con for November and that they have Linda Hamilton for it. DON'T YOU BELIEVE IT for one moment! These guys talk a big line and can't back it up. I can't discourage you enough from attending any of their cons. They are holding pre-registration money for quite a few people and I can't even help one person get their money back. I personally feel those of you whose money Jeff holds can kiss it goodbye. Jackie and I both had quite a bit of our own money invested in this project and got stiffed for it too. Another case of 'buyer be wary' I guess.
A small word to you about MasqueCon I. According to Sylvia Watson, as of July 1st, Ron Perlman is still on the attending guest list. Contracts are signed and back for Jay Acovone and Roy Dotrice. Negotiations are still going on with Ron. We'll keep you posted on details about this convention as we can.
By the way, Ron has changed agents again. STOP CALLING RODNEY!! He no longer has the time or desire to discuss Ron and will tell you so in pointed detail should you wish to waste your dime. Save your time and the man's nerves. He has no great love of fans in the first place. There is no word yet
of who is replacing him, but we'll let you know as soon as we find out.
Also from the editorial:
I would like, if I may, to get up on my soapbox once again. We have a problem that is really getting serious and I
have decided I would take the bull by the horns and tell you about it. In talking to other zine editors, we have all noticed a big decline in subscription and/or orders. We all realize that fandom is declining and the economy is the pits, but what we are all worried about is the growing idea of "pooling". That is one person buying the subscription or zine and sharing it around. While I will admit it is a tempting idea when you are broke, you also must realize that the way any zine editor judges interest is by the subscription base which translates into money to produce said product. When the orders drop, the money to produce it drops and then the product folds. The point I am making is this. If you enjoy a certain zine/letterzine/book, etc., TELL your friends about it. Sharing it around only endangers the product you enjoy. Only by monetarily supporting the things you and your friends like will you keep these things on the market. Otherwise, they might disappear and everyone loses. Think about it.
Issue 33: Excerpts from the Letters
I wish we could go back to the beginning when B&B first came on the air. Back to a time when we all were friends and didn't have to worry about stepping into a room and wondering if you're going to get your head ripped off.
(Sigh) I guess too much has been said and done to ever go back.
I'm burnt out from all the crap, too. I also long for the days when we did nothing but support each other and BAB. I'm sick of the griping, the backstabbing, the nitpicking, the moaning and groaning about something that's all water under the bridge. It's been almost two years now, hasn't it?? Please, Beth, don't give up. [1] The pleas for sanity and peace haven't fallen on deaf ears. We will continue despite the controversy, despite the pain and anguish we've all suffered. Hang in there, kid. Everyone will soon get fed up with these instigators who aren't happy unless there's anger and resentment circulating among fandom. I promise you, one day you'll wake up and this bull*&@!! will have faded away like yesterday's nightmare.
I'd like to borrow a few lines from A. 'Nea Dodson's last letter to "OUT... IN". I don't know where she stands in all this, but I hope she doesn't take offense. Ms. Dodson wrote, "it is undeniable censorship to ask that something you find unacceptable be wiped off the face of the earth, thereby making the decision as to what is acceptable for everyone else." Now she was talking about censorship in fanzines, but it fits perfectly regarding fandom and the upcoming Beauty and the Beast movie. We don't know what the future holds. We don't know if Linda will do the movie. However, to tell me that if Catherine doesn't return, then Koslow shouldn't waste his time doing a movie, or that the movie won't be worth seeing, is another load of crap. If the movie is not what YOU WANT, then be my guest. Don't see the film. No skin off my nose. But to say, in effect, if Catherine doesn't come back, then the movie should be scrapped; i.e., wiped off the face of the earth; that's ridiculous! You're making the decision for all of FANDOM. No one has the right to do that. No one!
I know there are more fans out there who feel as I do. We have just been the SILENT MAJORITY for so long, we're in a rut. Write Koslow. Tell him to do the movie, no matter what. There are millions of stories left to be told regarding Vincent, Father and that wonderful tunnel world we all escaped to for two and a half years.
One thing further; Roy said in New York that Linda might not be interested in doing a movie, should Terminator II be as big a hit as they're forecasting. Should that happen, should LINDA decide not to be a part of the movie, she should ACTUALLY COME OUT and SAY she's not interested in replaying Catherine. I wonder who these people are going to blame then. Any ideas?
On CNN, June 26, Linda was asked on "Larry King Live" if she was interested in doing anymore
"Beauty and the Beast". Kids it sure sounded like a definite "NO" to me. Where does that leave us - movie or NO movie? As Roy Dotrice has been quoted, repeatedly, saying at "South of Oz", "They have no intention of making the movie without Linda Hamilton". Or do they mean without "Catherine"? Sounds like this might be time for a re cast if "Catherine" appears in the movie.
Just a quick note to say how much I enjoyed the "South of Oz" convention in Orlando - despite a serious lack of regular meals and sleep!
It was wonderful to see Ron, Roy and Jay all in the same day - and on the same stage together! They're funny separately, but they're like a comedy routine when they're all together! It was a rare treat. It was special to have them share their time with us; we even got to spend Father's Day with "Father"!
I think the thing I enjoyed the most about the convention was meeting so many of my pen pals, the authors, artists and editors I admire and so many people who were previously just names on an envelope...or in a fan publication. I've never been hugged so much in my life and I loved every minute of it!
Luckily, I don't think "politics" got in the way at the convention. As I heard one lady say, "Some people like chocolate and some like strawberry, and neither one is wrong!".
I just received a letter from a New Jersey woman whose letter of inquiry (regarding zines) I'd recently answered. She's a new fan — you know, somebody who's thought for several years that she was the only "B&B" fan in the world. She never knew there was a "fandom." She just discovered zines.
In my welcoming letter I'd mentioned (very peripherally) the rift in fandom. She wrote back yesterday to say that she'd already discovered it — the hard way. Someone of us, a writer or editor, had responded to her general zine inquiry in an offensive and insulting way.
She'd written of her interest in stories that furthered the original spirit and storyline of the show. I'm certain that that inquiry was as politely phrased as the one I received. She was new to fandom and had no reason (yet) for hostility, nor any expectation of encountering any. "My feelings were terribly hurt," she wrote me; and now she's not sure if she wants to write to other fans anymore. I don't blame her. I'm ashamed of us.
I can't imagine "welcoming" an obviously new fan into our world in such a way. Perhaps it was done defensively, in reaction to some misperceived "attack." Whoever you are and whatever your reasons, you have effectively alienated that new fan from your faction and your point of view. And that was silly of you, don't you think? In other words, I made a new friend... and you didn't. Why? I deliberately avoided "turning her against" others whose views I haven't shared and then you did it to yourselves anyway. Why?
People, it just isn't that difficult to be gracious, even with those whose politics do not agree precisely with our own. I'd have thought this fandom, especially, would lend itself to that. If you can't manage graciousness, try for civility. Or send the flyers by themselves, or not at all. Or count to ten and think what Vincent might have done.
Then do it.
I thought Beth Blighton was right on the money for most of her LOC, especially the 'hurt/comfort' theory. How many zines have I read where either Vincent or Catherine is in the greatest peril (and this can and usually does include everything from 'emotional' to 'physical') before they are allowed their 'happy ending'? I really must object though to her opening comments re: the review that was written about "Black Cover" and more specifically, the personal (and seemingly hurtful) comments about the reviewer. I read the review. I found it to be unbiased, well-thought out and intelligent. Obviously, Beth did not. That's okay. What seems to me to be not okay is the personal attack that Beth launched in her LOC. I only met the reviewer after the review had come out. She was articulate, intelligent and passionate about B&B. Outspoken - YES. Vindictive - NO. As for Beth's comment, "...instead of relying on the highly agitated
and biased opinions of a total stranger." (the highlighting is mine). I don't know about the 'highly agitated' part, but all opinions are biased. They're our opinions. If the review had been a ranting, raving diatribe about what a piece of the zine was, I probably would have taken a much harder look at the review/reviewer. However, for me, it was not a drooling, snarling indictment - it was a well- written critique. One last comment on this issue (I can hear the sighs now). I don't call anyone a liar, whether they deserve it or not. I wish that kind of courtesy were more ingrained in this fandom, but from some of the letters I've seen, obviously that's not the case, yet. Well, maybe someday...
I have to tell you, I'm tired of fighting, of having to read about other fans bashing each other over who is the truest fan of all! Why can't we all be true fans? Who made up the criteria over 'true' fans vs. 'false' fans? And why wasn't I consulted? That's how ludicrous it seems to me!
I appreciated the writers in the last issue who acknowledged my opinion about Black Cover in a respectful way, whether they agreed with me or not. My letter was reactional, emotional and unedited and would have benefited tremendously from a few days' cooling-off period. I was relieved to see that for the most part the issue was treated calmly despite strong feelings on both sides.
I can accept the observation that there is such a wide range of quality and content in the zines out today that it would be impossible to draw a line anywhere, between sensual romance and pornographic sex, or violent good/evil confrontations and blood-and-gore titillation, or even between purposeful mental suffering and blatant emotional abuse for the sake of a plot. From that viewpoint, I can accept that there is no way to expect an editor to censor ads for zines, although it should be her prerogative.
[Marilyn D] offered an incisive opposing question: if we don't decide what's appropriate, then who? That's what I wonder also.
It's either us or someone outside of fandom or we simply set no standards at all. As a mother, I've re-learned the necessity for rules and limits and their enforcement, and after seven years of child-rearing I've learned to have confidence in taking a stand. In my mind, B&B is a fragile reality. Even as we push its boundaries outward with our artistic explorations, we need to protect and nurture its essence. We need to judge what is worth a risk to our reputation as a fandom that upholds and understands the ideals of the show. If censorship isn't the answer, that means even greater responsibility for each of us individually.
[...]
In the aftermath of the negative experience this controversy has been for many of us, perhaps we won't have to deal with this question I of appropriateness again. I'll be as glad as anyone to see it dropped. I don't understand why this topic evoked so much response...
The motto of my home state, Kentucky, is "United we stand, divided we fall". I think B&B fans would do well to remember this simple message. I am saddened by the discord in the fan community and I must admit puzzled. Why are we fighting? What good does it do?
I am a classic fan but I do not dislike anyone who enjoyed or even preferred the 3rd season. And I hope no one dislikes me because I did not. I have friends in both camps. There seems to be three types of fans; those who are mostly interested in Vincent and don't care who the Beauty is, those who preferred 3rd season and the classic 1st and 2nd season fans like myself. Some of the classic fans like Diana, some don't. I enjoyed her performance and character but I miss
Catherine too much to get any pleasure from her relationship with Vincent. However, I can accept her in an alternate reality story. This is a fantasy folks. Come on, lighten up. There's room for many different viewpoints in this fandom and if B&B taught us anything at all it was tolerance of those who are different from ourselves.
Since at this point we have NO control over the movie, I'm not limiting anything. I know many fans can accept whatever direction the show might take, but just as many fans cannot. It's just how things are and we have to accept that reality.
It tears me up that some fans are feeling terribly disenfranchised these days. I felt that way during third season and I wouldn't wish it on anyone! However, it's troubling that some people are taking the "misery loves company" approach. I have little sympathy for individuals that pen LOC's with the sole intent of annoying people. That's NOT B&B. Nothing anyone else says or does can ultimately change how I feel about the show or any particular character. Nhy would I grant someone that power? Don't blame OTHERS for your misery. I didn't like the 3rd season because Catherine died yet I still am very much in love with Vincent and Catherine's story. Nothing can change that. Letterzines are for the expression of opinions and just because I don't agree with someone's statements doesn't mean they are "shoving them down my throat." The only thing I object to is abrasiveness for the sake of being abrasive. If you liked third season or Diana, then tell me why.
Let's forget the labels, pointing out who is to blame and just exactly WHO is supporting "Beauty and the Beast". That's impossible to define since the show means so many different things to so many different people.
Issue 34
Once Upon a Time... Is Now 34 was published in August 1991.
Issue 34: Excerpts from the Letters
Reality hit me in the face when I returned from "South of Oz"; but I had a great time. It was incredible to have Roy, Ron and Jay together - it was terrific to have Vincent's chamber there - it was wonderful to meet so many fun people from all over the country who love the same things I do. What a wonderful way to spend a weekend!!!
....Our local Minnesota B&B Society ("Of things that are not and that should be...") spent the past few months getting involved with a local Twin Cities multi-media convention called PolarisCon II. One of our members was the CEO and was pulling heavily with her fellow board members (Time, Space, & Fantasy, Inc.) to bring in a B&B guest....
....The guest who agreed to come was Armin Shimerman, and since several of us had met him briefly at TunnelCon, we became more excited....
....The highlight of the convention for those of us who were B&B family were the times I was able to arrange informal gatherings with Armin so he could meet each of us as he requested and get to know us more one-on-one....
....Armin really became a brother to us during those times, earning our deepest respect and admiration. He swore us to secrecy about some news he shared, but I can tell you all (if you don't already know) that Irina is marrying a man named Michael on Labor Day, and is beginning a career in music with him. Armin also gave me permission to start a rumor he heard just before he came, but will leave up to fandom to unravel. Are you ready? There is B&B out-take footage!! He doesn’t know anymore particulars, so can share nothing else except the fact that they exist - but he's confident that the sleuths among us are capable of meeting this challenge....
....Having gone to TunnelCon and South of Oz, I can honestly say that a large part of the attraction of a con, at least for me, is getting to meet people who I have become friends with through the mail or getting to see these people again. Many of us went through a lot to get to these cons, and I for one enjoyed it that much more.
I am also saddened that a few of fandom's best and brightest talents seem to have lost sight of the original intent of Beauty and the Beast. Have you forgotten the dream? Was the magic between Vincent and Catherine only incidental to you?
I, too, find Vincent incredibly attractive with more sheer sex appeal than seems fair. BUT, he doesn't belong to me. He doesn't belong to Diana and he doesn't belong to any character you deem to invent. He belongs, body and soul, to Catherine and he always will. He is pledged to her whatever happens, whatever comes. He is as constant as the North star.
His love will never waver, his commitment to her will never falter. To deny that, to circumvent that, is to deny Vincent the very thing that defines the greatness of his soul. Catherine was not a stepping stone on Vincent's journey to self -acceptance. She was not conceived as a peripheral character. "Beauty and the Beast" was her story. The title was not" Beast and the Beauty".
Ron Perlman did not get top billing over Linda Hamilton. Catherine Chandler was the foundation the entire show was built upon and when that foundation was cruelly and ruthlessly shattered, the great golden mansion that was once Beauty and the Beast crumbled into a smoking heap of rubble. Like a mighty forest that has been logged to the ground, you knew it had once been something bright and beautiful, but only because you recognised the stumps.
I thought I'd be numb after having watched something I cherished be savagely mutilated in search of Neilson ratings; but I'm not. Fan fiction has not been kind. Oh, how I detest stories that pair Vincent with another woman What a perversion of his character! There seems to be some element in human nature that spurs us to prove heroes have feet of clay. Casting Vincent as a lover to any woman, other than his bonded soulmate, serves to diminish his stature. It takes away from the mythic quality that helped to make him heroic in the first place. Why can't you let him keep his nobility? In my opinion, those who saw Beauty and the Beast only as a vehicle for a big sexy, leonine man, didn't " get it", any more than those critics who never saw more to Vincent than a hairy, oversized, poetry- spouting freak who lives in a sewer.
On the upside, I still believe that love in its deepest purest form exists. It is Vincent and Catherine. It is timeless, it is impregnable and I have every confidence that it will endure, despite the efforts being made to undermine the enormous scope of it.
References
- ^ This is a reference to Blighton's letter, It seems that the trend in fandom is to believe the first shocking thing we hear from the first "politically correct" mouth we hear it from..