Talk:Captain America Movieverse

Can anyone update this page to bring it up-to-date with Captain America: The Winter Soldier info? I'm assuming we want to keep it in line with pages like Iron Man Movieverse and The Avengers Movieverse.

Actually, I really only need someone else to retitle it Captain America Movieverse. Then I can fill in some of the stuff. I just feel weird doing that while the title is still Captain America: The First Avenger. PhoenixFalls (talk) 00:46, 21 May 2014 (UTC)

Is this a separate fandom from the Marvel Cinematic Universe? --Doro (talk) 11:40, 28 June 2014 (UTC)

Like the Iron Man Movieverse and the Thor Movieverse, there's a lot of overlap, but there's definitely fandom activity that is specific to the Captain America movies (+The Avengers) only. --PhoenixFalls (talk) 17:34, 28 June 2014 (UTC)

Yes, but it's all pretty much the same universe, right? The way I see it, it's more a division along pairing lines and that's no different from any other fandom. Depending on the pairing, some people focus more on this or that episode, and in the MCU the equivalent is a focus on this or that movie. Doesn't make it a separate fandom, though. Marvel fandom is complicated. *sigh* The point is, for movieverse Steve/Sam, the canon is pretty much Captain America 2. For movieverse Steve/Bucky, it's Captain America 1 and 2 + The Avengers and for movieverse Steve/Tony it's Captain America 1 and 2, Iron Man 1 - 3 and The Avengers. It's all the same movieverse. --Doro (talk) 22:04, 28 June 2014 (UTC)

Yeah it's the same universe (Earth-199999), but I don't think it's comparable to a television show with individual episodes. It's much more similar to the comics, for obvious reasons, where you have all of Marvel-616 taking place in the same universe (Earth-616) but each individual title has its own arc until the big all-universe events that happen every couple years, than it is to a television series and its individual episodes. Fans of a television show have to take all of the episodes as canon, even if they choose to focus on certain episodes or seasons. Fans of one of the movie franchises can totally ignore all the rest of the MCU, and I'd argue they do. There are definitely large segments of the fandom that only engage with the Iron Man movies, or the Thor movies, or the Captain America movies, or The Avengers where they've created that very comics-influenced AU where everybody moved in together and thus they ignore all of Phase 2. While that looks like it's happening along pairing lines I don't think it really is. You're more likely to find someone who ships both Steve/Bucky and Steve/Sam than someone who ships both Steve/Bucky and Steve/Tony, for example, because the person who ships both Steve/Bucky and Steve/Sam is really just a Captain America fan while the person who ships Steve/Bucky and Steve/Tony would have to be primarily interested in both the Captain America and Avengers fandoms. And I've literally never met someone who shipped, for example, Steve/Bucky, Steve/Tony, and Tony/Rhodey, because that requires interest in and knowledge of three separate fandoms (Captain America, Avengers, and Iron Man). Not to mention the complicating factor of Agents of SHIELD, which is also in the same universe and actually engages directly with all the Phase 2 movies, but has very little overlap with any of the movie fandoms. (There's some overlap with Avengers-based Clint/Coulson fans writing stuff using Agents of SHIELD as a backdrop, but most of the people I know who were into MCU before Agents of SHIELD hate Agents of SHIELD, and most of the Agents of SHIELD fans I know weren't into the movies before the show. And looking forward, Guardians of the Galaxy will likely be even more separate, since whatever happens in it won't be tied into the events here on Earth in the MCU until Age of Ultron comes out.

I'm not being as clear as I'd like. But really, I don't know why you're asking this? I definitely don't think it makes sense to merge all the pages here on Fanlore -- for one thing, it would just make the MCU page way too large and unwieldy. --PhoenixFalls (talk) 23:04, 28 June 2014 (UTC)

Still thinking it through. . . it might be a more apt comparison to say the MCU is like the Joss-verse, particularly the Buffy and Angel parts of it. Same universe, and some times it acts like a unified canon/fandom; but other times it just acts like a crossover that you could have between any two shows, and other times still it feels completely separate. --PhoenixFalls (talk) 23:24, 28 June 2014 (UTC)

I have to agree with PhoenixFalls, each film series (Captain America, Iron Man, Thor, Agents of SHIELD and even Hulk) are generally considered separate except for when they group all the characters together which turns it to the Avengers (which itself turned into a separate fandom after it's release). It would cause the MCU article to become unwieldy and whatnot (which the article was longer previously before someone cut it down to its current size which is fine now that the Movieverse fandoms are separated and are expanding in size as well. It's similar to the Jossverse of Buffy/Angel, however MCU extends to much larger separate fandoms (which will at least be eight after Guardians & Agent Carter is released, even more once Ant-Man, Daredevil, and the others will be released). I think it would be prudent to keep the separate Movieverse fandoms even with some of the overlaps - I think there is enough differences that it should be okay for them to stay separated. Otherwise some of the pages might just become too long, which like the The Avengers (Marvel) page had been (it becomes really distracting and annoying because you're looking for one thing but get a whole lot more than you are a fan of the film and not the comics or cartoons). The same could be said for the X-Men Movieverse and X-Men: First Class, XMFC is apart of the Movieverse, but it received a separate page because of the fandom. I agree it's hard to judge Marvel Fandoms, probably any major comic book fandoms like DC Comics is going to be hard. But I think it's really worth to keep them separated. --Harpie (talk) 00:57, 29 June 2014 (UTC)

I agree with both PhoenixFalls and Harpie here. There are fans who are only fans of the Iron Man movies who don't care anything about the characters from the Captain America Universe and vice versa, people who are only into the Thor movies, and fans who are more into Avengers and some who are into all Marvel movies. Quite a few Avengers fans aren't watching Agents of SHIELD etc. There are definitely noticeable differences in the separate fic fandoms (different tropes, themes etc.) and I'm sure there isn't always overlap and with more movies and properties coming I'm sure we'll soon have a separate fandom for the Guardians of the Galaxy with people who won't be into the Avengers characters and so on. They are different fandoms, even though the movies are set in the whole universe. Maybe we can find some meta about that we could link to on the MCU page? I'm sure that there has been some in the separate fandoms, but I can't find anything in my links at the moment.--Fantomas (talk) 08:27, 29 June 2014 (UTC)