Talk:Aziraphale/Crowley

Proposal to merge trope sections

I am thinking that the tropes sections for the book and TV fandoms should be merged because they have very similar tropes. However, I don't know a lot about the book fandom, so if I could get some community feedback I would appreciate it -- Kingstoken (talk) 20:13, 18 September 2021 (UTC)

I'd be okay with that. We can try to specify if a trope/storyline started in book fandom or only became common with show fandom, but I understand that's difficult to do in a lot of cases, and esp. with a fandom as old as GO. --Auntags (talk) 21:56, 18 September 2021 (UTC)

Okay, I am going to merge the tropes sections, and we can specify if any individual tropes are different between book and show. Thanks for your help -- Kingstoken (talk) 22:22, 18 September 2021 (UTC)

Discussion re “gender”

In the infobox, it internally links genderswap for Ineffable Wives, and I do know they appear male but given they’re not human, should we link genderswap or femslash? Also, should we put an Examples Wanted tag on this page for examples involving explicit ace, trans, or non-penis sex (which could include any gender presentation)? Joanna R (talk) 02:51, 19 May 2022 (UTC)

Just on the Ineffable Wives link: I'm wondering if Ineffable Wives should have its own trope page. I'm not very familiar with this trope, but there are > 700 fanworks in the Ao3 tag. Could we make Ineffable Wives a redlink, to encourage editors to create the page? --Auntags (talk) 09:44, 21 May 2022 (UTC) Stub created! Joanna R (talk) 22:21, 21 May 2022 (UTC)

Ineffable Wives, and other variations on the Azira/Crowley relationship perhaps should have a page of their own, but for now I feel that a section like trope would do well. because even if they are pers genderless characters that fluctuate between human binarism (manman, woman, NB and the like), their carnal variations don't seem big enough for a page of their own. because in theory is and is not a trope, but almost a "genderbender". It is sometimes difficult to categorize what goes into GO fandom. if a trope page involved all the variations of the couple it would be interesting. But I think I may be talking nonsense, I've only seen the series and I'm not very involved with the other versions. I know there is reverse Omens, radio Omens and the like.--Ellakbhesse (talk) 15:46, 21 May 2022 (UTC)

Auntags, I agree. I don’t read much in the trope myself, but I think we all see a bunch of fanworks and fanart around Tumblr to make it worth a Trope page. My one caveat, and I think this fits with your suggestion, is to make it a page linked off this main A/C page, i.e. in the Trope section itself put the redlink, because I think it’s key to this pairing that Aziraphale and Crowley themselves are represented with a lot of different gender presentations in fanworks. I’m good with turning it into a redlink - honestly I know enough to create a stub - and probably adding it to femslash categories. Do you think we should just remove the “when female” parentheses in the infobox? I think it’s pretty self-explanatory, it avoids the question of whether this is genderswap (I personally don’t think so), and there’s no other parentheses with the other alternate names. Joanna R (talk) 18:47, 21 May 2022 (UTC)

I created the Ineffable Wives stub, removed the genderswap internal link in the infobox and added the internal link to IW, added other pairing types besides M/M into the infobox, and put in Examples Wanted for fanworks besides specific M/M. Plus there was no mention of monster-fucking so I added that too! Lol gotta widen the scope here! If it was too soon (i.e. not enough discussion) on any of that, I’m open to more. Joanna R (talk) 22:45, 21 May 2022 (UTC)