Cream Lemon Dispute
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| Title: | Cream Lemon Dispute |
| Creator: | Earth Defense Command, Randall S. Stukey |
| Date(s): | Published June 1989 |
| Medium: | |
| Fandom: | Anime, Cream Lemon |
| Topic: | Alleged conditions of the anime video room at the Dallas Fantasy Fair; showing explicit content at cons; Stukey and EDC's respective positions on the artistic merits of Cream Lemon |
| External Links: | June 1989 issue on Archive.org |
| Click here for related articles on Fanlore. | |
Cream Lemon Dispute was the title of a letter exchange published in the final issue of Celluloid Diversions, concerning the Earth Defense Command's response to statements made by editor Randall S. Stukey on their policy of showing Cream Lemon at cons.
Dispute
In regard to the March issue of Celluloid Diversions, the EDC must strongly object to your reply to correspondence... concerning Cream Lemon Videos. Amidst your editorial remarks about Animag, factions in California fandom, etc., you make inaccurate and damagingly misleading remarks about the EDC-run videorooms at the Dallas Fantasy Fairs, stating that...the EDC continues to have all-night Cream Lemon Festivals at Dallas Fantasy Fairs. They claim the material being shown is "PG-13" and allow anyone to watch it, no matter how young! This is only asking for [eventual] trouble from [the] press and anti-porn groups.
Your remarks contradict EDC attitudes concerning Cream Lemon videos. We have never made any claims that Cream Lemon videos are PG-13 material. Rating film is the province of the Motion Picture Board; the EDC does not presume to rate these videos. We do not allow just anyone to watch these "no matter how young." And we do not allow this material to be screened in such ways as would "only (be) asking for trouble from the press and anti-porn groups."
At Dallas Fantasy Fairs, Cream Lemon videos are only shown in limited numbers late at night before the “People's Choice" selections. The play list Is well-marked outside the room. The anime video room itself Is not in a heavily- trafficked area of the convention, it is in fact well away from other convention activities; the surrounding rooms are closed. Thus accessibility to the Cream Lemon screenings is limited to those interested parties who are directly looking to purview that material. We keep security in the rooms, not necessarily at the doors, and those underage persons who might wander in despite the “Adult Only" warning are approached and quietly asked to leave.
[...]
In the main, Randall, what is deemed appropriate viewing material at a sclence fiction convention must be taken into consideration, at conventions all over the world such live action films as Friday the 13th, Brainstorm, A Clockwork Orange, Flesh Gordon, Rocky Horror Picture Show, Barbarella, Monty Python And the Holy Grail, Vamp, The Hunger, Cat People, the Bond films, Hellraiser, LifeForce, etc. are shown, to name a few. All these films contain material that sensitive viewers might find objectionable. Nevertheless, they are typically shown at all hours, without common sense discretion, and more importantly, without audience objection. The literature of Science Fiction is filled with controversial material. From H.G. Wells to Ron Hubbard, Heinlein, and Phillip Jose Farmer a long-standing tradition of material and ideas exists which can be considered shocking, objectionable, or controversial. Science fiction convention art shows contain pieces which are more distinctly explicit than any Cream Lemon videos that the EDC would consider screening. And, if you have attended many conventions costume contests, you are aware of the controversial examples presented by the fans themselves; i.e., the half-naked slave woman or the scantily armored amazon, both popular motifs. What differentiates the attitude behind the EDC and its anime programming choices from some of these other examples can be perceived in parallel to a situation found at a dealer's table. Twice, at two different conventions, with two different dealers, a Kirk/Spock (KS) fanzine was displayed along the front line of merchandise, despite its rather explicit cover. Other dealers carry these types of zines also, however, they generally place them in boxes labeled as such or as "specialized fanzines", thereby showing discretion and taste. We, the EDC, like the latter dealers, have some limited amount of mature material, yet are willing to show discretion and taste in its handling, in accordance with standards of responsible behavior. The EDC hopes that the benefits of such responsibly-handled screenings of Cream Lemon can be seen versus the possible dangers of its irresponsible display. We hope that other clubs working convention video rooms will follow our example by showing Cream Lemon videos only in proper, well-designated areas during off hours at a convention.The Staff of the EDC
First of all, I will apologize for the statement "They claim the material being shown is 'PG-13 and they allow anyone to watch it, no matter how young". This statement was made to me by a friend of one of the EDC staff members who called me claiming to represent the EDC and Bulldog Productions after I wrote a letter to the EDC on this issue in early January of this year. In spite of what this person sald, it is apparently not the position of the EDC that the Cream Lemon material they show Is “PG-13" material sultable for viewing by all ages, I am sorry for thls misunderstanding, but if the EDC had replied to my original letter and phone calls on this subject directly, instead of through an intermediary, this unfortunate statement would never have seen print.However, I feel obligated to disagree with much of this letter. First of all, In regard to the EDC's handling of the showing of Cream Lemon videos:
1) The "play lists" on the doors of the anime vidroom do not always indicate that a given video is "adult" material, but just list the title and showing time. For example, if you were unfamiliar with Cream Lemon- type videos would you know that the titles Star Trap and Raul were adult videos?
2) While the video room is not in a "well-trafficked area of the con, it is often right next door to the film vidroom and at DFFs that I have been to, people have to open the door and look in to tell the vidrooms apart (after the signs disappear to some "souvenir collector").
3) The person running the (normally quite dark) vidrooms is usually seated in the front of the vidroom, with his/her back to the majority of the audience, watching the videos instead of who is coming In the vidroom. I have seen this during the showing of Cream Lemon material just as I have seen people under 18 in the video room during these showings. The person running the room during the showing of these material should be right by the door and watching people who come in instead of the videos (better yet, he should be outside the door checking IDs).
The EDC claims that people want to see Cream Lemon videos in the vidroom. I can believe that, but that is still no reason to show them. I imagine that, if asked, you'd get a lot of fans who would like to see "Debbie Does Dallas" and "Deep Throat" shown in the film vidroom (especially if they were substituted for some of the dreadful stuff that used to be shown at every DFF in the film vidroom), but that would not make it a good idea to show these films!
This letter seems to claim that Cream Lemon material Is no different that films like Flesh Gordon, Rocky Horror Picture Show, Barbarella, Monty Python and the Holy Grail, LifeForce, and the like. I beg to differ here, thereis a great deal of difference. While the films mentioned do show nudity and people going at it in bed, they do not show the actual sex act with close-ups on the sexual organs in action as much of the Cream Lemon material does (admitted with electronic fuzzing of the sexual organs). Also the films mentioned have a plot of which the sex, violence, and/or nudity is but one element of. The Cream Lemon videos that I have seen (about 20 of them) have little real plot and are more like juvenile wet dreams than real stories. In my opinion, the great majority of these videos have more in common with "Debbie Does Dallas" and "Deep Throat" than the films listed in the above letter. It seems to be that anyone who considers Cream Lemon type videos to be acceptable con fare (for a vidroom that does not check IDs) would have to consider "Debble Does Dallas" and/or "Deep Throat" acceptable fare for the same con vidroom if someone electronically fuzzed the sex organs in these films - a position that I do not believe many would take. (In regard to art shows and costume contests: Very little of the art in the art shows I've seen at cons depicts graphic sex activity and I have never seen any nudity (Just an occasional bare breast), let alone any on-stage sexual activity, at any costume contest at any of the numerous conventions I've been to in my years of fandom — so I think that apples and oranges are being compared with these statements.)
I would like to point out, as I have before, that these materials are basically pornography. Soft-core porno- graphy, true, but still pornography and suffering from all its ills. These videos are violent, often show rape and violent sex performed with unwilling partners, and are in general demeaning to our humanity. This has never been the image we as science fiction fans have tried to project and I really hate to see it done today. While some may think that showing these videos in con video rooms is an expression of their freedom of speech, in my opinion, all that the public showing of these videos at cons demonstrates Is poor taste, poor Judgment, and a lack of concern for the demeaning nature of pornography.
Finally, I think this is something that the leadership of the EDC and the leadership of the C/FO are simply going to have to "agree to disagree on." The C/FO is not going to blacklist the EDC because they choose to show Cream Lemons in the con vidrooms they run, we just will not help them run these vidrooms by providing tapes and occasional assistance in actually running the vidrooms as we have in the past. The EDC is still one of three anime groups I recommend to people who ask me what groups the should consider joining and this disagreement is not going to change that. However, I hope that their policy does not backfire on anime fandom in the long run - whereas I will not do anything about their policies other than bitch, complain, and try to convince them to change them when the topic comes up, both the I and the EDC staff know there are others who may feel obligated to involve parties outside of fandom in this matter.—RSS