Top!Joe (Discord server)
| Discord server | |
|---|---|
| Name | Top!Joe |
| Date(s) | 2020-2020 (Closed) |
| Fandom(s) | The Old Guard |
| Scope | Joe/Nicky, Yusuf al-Kaysani, Nicolo di Genova |
| Access | Closed |
| Related articles on Fanlore. | |
The Top!Joe Discord was begun in the summer of 2020 shortly after the release of The Old Guard in response to claims by some parts of the fandom that depictions of Joe/Nicky in which Joe (Yusuf al-Kaysani) topped Nicky (Nicolo di Genova) were inherently racist. Members of the discord dispute this claim and gather to write fics featuring Top!Joe.
Announcement Post(s)
I really love joe and nicky but my preference is joe topping, I think it caters more to me from the spooning scene and their personalities but seems like everyone on tumblr doesn’t really like the concept of top!joe and I feel I have no one to talk to. truth to be told these switchers are lovely but these switch and bottom joe talk is not really my cuppa tea… well um… I also feel judged in this fandom… this is really draining, better leave the fandom…DOES THIS DESCRIBE YOU? JOIN MY TOP!JOE DISCORD AND LET’S FEED EACH OTHER FOOD.
wait there’s a top!Joe discord?
YA! major writers and artists are also there
cool, I WANT IN
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So, this is the official post that this discord is accepting new members. We are prioritizing people with strict preference and switchers with preference of top!joe. We originally wanted to invite 50/50 switchers/people with no preference but we already invited these people and we decided they can only join by referral only.
How to join: message me, you will be vetted first.[1]
FAQ
Sounds great but even though I prefer top!joe, I want to talk about bottom!joe too :(That’s okay, may I direct you to these discords (they aren’t affiliated with mine) :
- disaster immortals (18+): https://discord.gg/g2RU3h38W7
- all and more (18+): https://discord.gg/MdhHZBY (run by @avengernewsb)
If there is a bottom!joe discord, let me know I will put the invite link here.
top!Joe has a racist root, please be aware that you’re racist.
In my opinion, racism is not inherently tied to dynamics. However I can understand how some top!joe writers putting focus on Nicky can make you uncomfortable by the virtue of the white man getting the attention/focus alone, generally, I do agree that people tend to focus on the bottom and tend to whump him and I can see why people can think they’re racist for doing this because the fact that joe is a man of color only serve to highlight the difference. People tend to prefer the bottom because (i’m not saying everyone does this) they tend to be the vessel for the writer. From this point of view, say if this fandom is 90% top!joe, I can see why it makes people uncomfortable. And I don’t blame people taking precautions because it can get out of hand fast.
The worst thing that could happen is people solely talking about Nicky and completely ignoring Joe. But, the fandom is already pretty even when it comes to top/bottom, and therefore who gets the whump/attention, etc. TONS of people are switchers already and a lot of people prefer bottom!joe. Whump!joe content is not non-existent. Imo, at this point, you are just arguing with top!Joe people for the sake of arguing. Preferring Nicky over Joe (which is the case for some top!joe shippers) might be rooted from racial biases that permeate society AT BEST, we don’t disagree, however saying it’s racist and treating the shippers like they are plague and disgrace to the society is taking it way too far. You might think that preferring Joe to top and Nicky to bottom are also rooted from racial biases, we don’t disagree. However, there’s also another factor that comes into play that’s called (this is just my opinion) heteronormativity which some people might think are equally bad. Just because you don’t like Nicky to exclusively bottom and and cannot see why he should, does not mean you are right in making any assumption about why some people prefer Joe to top and Nicky to bottom. The same way why we think bottom!joe shippers are just being politically correct and/or whump!joe is even more racist but you know that’s not true. I’m sure all of this is just a preference. Please know, yes there are top!joe people who are all about whump!nicky and some of them are very loud in expressing their love to Luca and therefore, Nicky. but not all. A lot of them are just neutral and just prefer Joe to top and Nicky to bottom. However, people preferring Nicky and to whump Nicky are very normal. It’s normal to have a one sided preference in your ship. You’re putting words into their mouth just because you feel uncomfortable with it and you disagree with their interpretation of the characters.
If you are afraid we’re gonna turn the entire AO3 into bottom!nicky fest, calm down, it’s not happening. I just think top!joe shippers deserve a place in this fandom. We are not gonna harass switch and bottom!joe writers. All we ask is to be left alone. I think people minding their own business is the best option this fandom can have.
You see I think it’s pretty weird that you made a discord solely for top!joe?
Not at all! People preferring one dynamics over the other is common. Anyone who’s been in a fandom know top/bottom discourse is a thing. Top!x discords are super common especially when the dynamic is not popular/susceptible to abuse. It’s a way to gather people with likeminded interest. Also this discord is created because fandom toxicity. If people just minded their own business, I wouldn’t have made this discord.
Why not just join the other discords? It’s not like they are not allowing top!joe?
You are right, however talking to switchers are very different from talking to people with same wavelength and probably share one braincell. Some members of this discord are in other discords and they said they prefer my discord… so that’s something.
I think they will switch since they’re 900 years old and it’s just much more realistic!
Oh nobody’s disputing that. We just want to talk about the moments joe tops. Or you know Joe could have tried it and he didn’t like it. Besides realistically, I don’t think they have sex anymore after 900 years old. Nobody understands the mind of 900 yo grandpas. Nobody has lived for 900 years. We all could be wrong for what it’s worth…
Top!joe is still problematic :(
well ok then [1]