Media Fandom Oral History Project Interview with Lorraine Brevig

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Interviews by Fans
Title: Media Fandom Oral History Project Interview with Lorraine Brevig
Interviewer: Megan Genovese
Interviewee: Lorraine Brevig
Date(s): August 12, 2017
Medium: audio recording, print transcript available
Fandom(s): Lord of the Rings, The Sentinel, Star Trek: TOS, Sherlock, The Professionals, Starsky & Hutch
External Links:
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In 2017, Lorraine Brevig was interviewed as part of the Media Fandom Oral History Project.

Length: 48:51.

For more information about the origins of this interview, where it is housed, contact information, suggestions regarding future interviewee candidates, and how to become volunteer interviewer or transcriber, see the Media Fandom Oral History Project page.

Topics Discussed

Excerpts

I've kind of always been into [fandom] since I was a kid, but I didn't know that there was, you know, organized fandom. I was just a big fan of like Starsky & Hutch and Emergency!, and things when I was a kid... I was like 14 in '74 and Starsky & Hutch had, I think come out in '75. I think. I loved that show. I didn't know why. I didn't realize that it was a pretty unique kind of show.

I started doing artwork of all my favorite characters and starting doing drawings of them. And then, I went away to school and grad school and everything like that. And then when the internet got kind of big, in I guess around 2000, I discovered on-line fan fiction. And then I was like I can do fan art; I did not know that such a thing really existed.

... I started doing some illustrations for some of [Cara Loup's] stories and then she asked me, cause I loved her work. if I would be willing to contribute to the zine she was going to put together and that was the first time [I'd done fanart for others]. I really didn't know much about zines either.

[...] I wouldn't call myself an illustrator, I'd call myself more a portrait artist. But, I can inspire to being as wonderful as Suzan Lovett but nowhere near (laughs) in terms of illustration.

I've tried a little bit in color pencil because there are other artists out there, Kate Nuernberg and some of the others who have been doing color pencil for a really long time, Karen River is, I think, another one. And I've really admired how those look but I've, I've never really done much in color pencil before and I have, so I tried some. And I'll tell you what, it's, it's a very tough medium. Very time-consuming and I don't think I'll be doing that again. But my admiration for them is quadrupled (laughs) ever since I tried that medium. But yeah, oils are pretty much my, my major, um, my major medium.

It's kind of different now-a-days cause most of the kids who are doing this stuff are doing, you know, graphic, what do you call it, 3-D Photoshop, you know, that kind of stuff. And that's just not something I'm ever really going to be really interested in doing.

Computer art. (pause) Some of them are pretty amazing at it and then some of them are really awful.

Well, I'll never get tired of Starsky & Hutch, I have to tell you that. They were kind of my first love. (laughs)

I actually have on my website a drawing of Hutch that I did when I was 17. I did it on typing paper with a number 2 pencil. And so I put, I decided, it's about the only thing that survived from time period and so I put it on my website. But yeah, Starsky & Hutch is a huge favorite. Right now, I really like Sherlock, and, uh, BBC Sherlock. And, I don't think I'll ever get tired of The Professionals either, the British show. So. I really like these, drawing these British men, because they have a lot of character to their faces. They're not your traditional kind of Hollywood face. And I really also, I like Star Trek, the original series of Kirk and Spock.

Somebody asked me to do Hannibal and I wasn't even sure what that was. And, and at that time, I was very busy and I just couldn't... You know, it's one of those things where you kind of have only a limited amount of energy to, to focus on a particular thing. And my mother had just passed away and I just was like I just can't deal with it. I apologized, but I just couldn't do it. Cause it usually means for me having to do sort of a lot of research and looking into the fandom and learning about it and that, that's kind of time consuming. And if it's not something that I'm going to be particularly interested in, I'm not going to do a really good job of it. I found that out, when somebody asked me to do, I think it was one of the Star Trek, sorry, excuse me, Star Wars, uh, sequels. Um, Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon, I think. I just didn't do a very good job of it, because I couldn't get into the characters.

So, I felt bad about that. I felt bad that because I couldn't produce a really...satisfactory... I mean, the person who ask for it, liked it, but I just didn't like it was my best work. And, I just didn't want to do that again. So, that's why I've been turning down things of... you know, doing commissions for people in fandoms I'm not familiar with. I have a very limited attention span these days.

That's probably part of the reason I didn't become a commercial artist, because if I'm not interested in something I get bored really quick. And, it's like torture trying to force myself to do the work. This is supposed to be fun. At least, that's how I approach fan art and fan fiction. And if it's not fun, why am I doing it. (laughs)

I loved working with [Kerry T] and [ Dana Austin Marsh]. It was like, they would suggest something and it would just like pop into my head and I would be able to do it and they loved it. It was teamwork, you know,and it was great. It worked really well.

And, working with, with P.R. Zed was a lot of fun. She was in The Professionals at that time and she did a really wonderful zine. ... I think it's "Exile." And um, uh I just I had a lot of fun working with her.... The one I really wanted to do, that I did that I don't think anyone really ever saw (laughs) was Birdwatchers Guide to Cornish Ghosts which written by Lizzie. I did like nineteen illustrations for that thing. And again, it was a Professionals kind of alternate universe zine. But, I loved the story. It was very satisfying but it kinda of wore me out, I have to tell you right now. It just really wore me out... But mostly, I think I've been doing more cover than anything.

I was working under my real name all along. And, um, and then my boss, at the time, decided she didn't want me using my full name, because people could Google my name and find slash art work. I thought, well she's afraid that our clients would do that. And she was right about that. So, I asked people just call me Lorraine, if possible. And, and I've put all my slash stuff behind password protection. So, but even, some of it's still out there and easy to find, still. But, I doubt our clients are going to look too hard, you know, for that kind of stuff... I hope so anyway...

Finding, finding slash on the internet was something that... I was a little surprised. It was the kind of stuff that I was wanting to find... I could never find it.

I don't know if you remember back, oh god, in the 70's, I think Myrna Culbreth and, um... Of course, you're probably too young for this... (laughs) Myrna Culbreth put out, I think it was called "Fate of the Phoenix." She put a whole series of Star Trek kind of alternate universe novels out there that kind of walked that fine line of slash between Kirk and Spock. Never went over the line. But it was like "Oh, I really like this." And, you know, and I realized that this is what I liked about Starsky & Hutch, is because they were two men that loved each other even though there was really nothing going on. But, you know, there was just one step cross that line and you've got slash, so. And it wasn't until like 2000 that I discovered slash. And, and I thought whoa, I like this and I want to, you know... My mother, always knew that I was interested in these things and she thought it was hilarious. And I would show her my artwork and she just thought it was amazing. . But she'd see my slash stuff and she'd laugh. I tried not to do anything really overtly graphic. But, um, you know, she thought it was hilarious.

Yeah, I have [been asked to do more explicit work]. But I really kind of never got around to it. I didn't really say yes. I know Suzan had some good suggestions for me and uh,a few times. But I just never... It just wasn't that interesting to me. As opposed to, you know, porno. I was more interested in the romantic kind of aspects of it.

[Had I thought of slash before finding it on the internet? No.] I saw that and like "Oh, okay. That's why I like Starsky & Hutch. That's why I like Kirk and Spock." 'Cause I, you know, I really hadn't thought about it. And I had roommates that were... I mean, my roommates were gay... all my college roommates were gay. (laughs) All these gay men everywhere. But it just sort of didn't occur to me, you know, that... You know, when you're in art school, it seems like every other person is gay.

[...] I really love the idea of two guys together. (laughs) And, and like I said, more in a more romantic rather than sexual, so much I guess. But, you know I guess, one leads to the other. But, you know, I'm, I'm the kind that likes to fade off to black kind of, if that makes sense.

You know, not, not, body part into... you know, tab A, slot B, whatever... That, tha twasn't as, as interesting to me as the romantic part. Or my imagined romantic part. 'Cause my, my... I would talk to my, my male, gay male friends and they would, they would say, you know,"Women like this? Women like two men together?" And I'm like "Uh, yeah." And they were just, they'd just blew their minds, it was pretty funny....

You know, my best friend, she's like, "I don't understand, but, you know, if that's what you like, that's fine." You know. So. It's like my roommate. He loves the idea of Xena and whatever her friend was. Gabrielle..... He loves the thought of them together. So, you know, he's on the, the internet lists and things like that. Or he used to be until, I think, they realized he was a guy. (laughs) They kicked him off. But yeah, he just, he just adores the thought of them together. So, you know, like well why can't I, you know, like the idea of Starsky & Hutch together?

I liked Sentinel a lot. And then I unfortunately learned a lesson about getting involved with communities because the communities can start... You know, they can be really friendly, accepting and open. And suddenly there are these... I was pretty much a newbie when this all happened, but they can sort of have a big split or fracture, sort of, philosophical differences and ways of viewing things and stuff that happens. And I just learned my lesson to not to get really heavily involved in communities, especially on-line communities, because it's really easy for people to kind of fly off the handle. And I prefer face-to-face. I like going to conventions and,when I can and meeting up like-minded people and talking face-to-face about stuff. So, and I've met some really lovely people.And,and it's just, it's a shame that, I guess,the face-to-face cons are not as prevalent as they used to be.

[...]

[That] really ugly split, unfortunately, and I still don't quite understand what happened. And, and it just... You know, I still love the, the... the characters and everything. But the, the...just the fandom, um, situation. And I understand that that's pretty common in fandom, if you get really involved in communities. I guess it's like church groups that disagree with each other and they split and go on to form separate churches or something. It's kind of along the... It was a learning experience for me, let's put it that way. And I don't hold it against the Sentinel [show] itself. But the fandom itself was pretty fractured. I've kept a number of friends from it... I still keep them as friends, but they've gone off to different fandoms, too.

I used to really love going to Media*West. And there were a couple of years when Kath, Moonshine and, and Glow...Glowrug, I guess she called herself, were putting together, I think they called it, Eastern Media Con up in Jersey. And that was a couple of years; they did a, a magnificent job. And, I've been to ConneXions a couple of times and that was a lot of fun. The first convention I ever went to was ConneXions. And I walked in there with, with one of my online friends I had met, and, and I looked at everybody and I said "These are my people." You know, it was the first time I had ever really felt that way. It was very weird. But it was great.

I have not experienced very much negativity from fans about my slash art. I think I'm lucky in that I came in later than most people. Because, I've heard some stories from some of the old guard about that kind of thing. Especially about the zines where they were literally threatened with lawsuits, or they were threatened that people were going to turn them into the powers that be, as they called them. And I know one woman who was... She was a kindergarten teacher in a really small town in the south. And she would have lost her job, everything, if, if that had happened.

But no, the only time I've ever had anything like that happen, even close to that, was when I was the art person at Eastern Media Con. And a gen person who normally goes to gen cons. And she came up and she was like "well, you really shouldn't be displaying these where children can see them." And I'm like, "Well, children aren't supposed to be in this room." (laughs) So, and that was kind of, that was the worst of it.

I'm trying to stay away from things like Tumblr and Facebook and stuff because those are HUGE time sinks. And I, you know, and I tend to really get sucked into things like that. And if I don't stay away from them, I don't get anything done. I can't get my laundry done. I can't do any...you know, it's like nothing gets done. And so, I'm, I'm trying real hard to stay away from that stuff. And I know that's kind of where things are happening these days, but... such is life.

Mpreg! Oh, yeah (laughs) That's hilarious. I just thought it was funny. I like Nancy's stories were, were...you know, I thought they were very clever. And, yeah, I know some people are really, really, squicked by mpreg. And they're really dismissive of it... But I like that and I like the Alpha... What is it? The Alpha/Omega, kind [of fanworks].... I just think it's interesting and I think it's very creative. And, I like when people will take something and then, and then build on it and make it... I think it's a very creative thing. I think it's kind of hilarious too, at the same time. So yeah, I did that for Nancy 'cause I'm real fond of Nancy.

Early on, um, I wrote a couple of, of Lord of the Rings things, stories. And, um, and then I wrote some Sherlock. And, but... it's like, it's like the Alpha/Omega mpreg stuff. So stay away from it if you're not interested in that.

Every now and then, you get the urge to do something different and so, I was like... There was a story, a set of stories that someone was writing and she just... suddenly stopped writing. And nobody knew where she went and she left us with a huge cliffhanger. And I'm like, "Well, shoot!" And...so, I just thought "Well, I'm gonna... I'm gonna not finish her story, but I wanted to do... I wanted something that would be sort of in the same universe that she had started and... and then I basically combined Sherlock with, umm, Sentinel and umm... and then did Alpha/Omega dynamics, as they call it. And, umm, I did three, I've done four stories in kind of the similar universes. I needed to get it out my system cause she just... I mean I loved her stories, but she never finished it. And... so I just, I had to do something. I don't know if you've ever felt that way. (laughs)

I consider myself a grade "C" writer compared to some people.... I wrote what I wanted, what I would have wanted to have read. And so other people seemed to liked it okay, too. I was really surprised that as many people did because it was such a weird combination of things, ... but I actually, you know, got a fair, got a fair number of people who seemed to like it, so... they're on AO3. But this, it's not under my name, it's under, uh, another name.

I was pretty busy just trying to, you know, make a living for a long time, and... and in my spare time, yeah just, you know, just... uh, doing the art because I, you know, I loved the characters and I loved the stories and, and I really loved working with the people that were putting these zines out. It was a lot of labor of love for me. And then , sometimes I would just do a painting or something and then somebody would "Hey! Could I use that as the cover?" I'm like "Sure, no problem."

And, um, I'm not really sure what to think about [fanworks and profit]. You know, when it comes to writing and stuff, I feel bad that the authors are not [receiving monetary compensation] as we all are borrowing somebody else's world that they've created. These authors, a lot of them, are astonishingly talented. And, and I personally enjoy reading, and I'd be willing to pay. And I always donate, whenever I can, to AO3. But I know that there are people out there who... I mean, I've been approached by people asking me if I would would do a commission. Or even when I was doing those stories, the... the... somebody asked me if I would basically write her a sex scene. (laughs) And I was like "Urp, I don't know." Umm... But... Umm... Yeah, I just... I, I'm, I'm a little, I'm not sure what to think about it, because I sometimes put, you know, like some of these paintings. I put a hundred hours into some of these paintings. If I'm going to sell them, if somebody want to buy them, I realize this is Legolas, or this is, you know, Frodo or somebody, and I didn't create them and this is Elijah Wood's, you know, his, his likeness but I'm translating it through me into another medium . And I understand that's permissible to do that. Now, making prints apparently is not permissible. So, I'm... You know, I keep hearing different things and, and now I think if somebody wants to to make money on it, that's fine with me.... .. if an author whom I really admire and, and if she had her own website and required that I log in and pay her, I would do it if I liked her work enough. But it is walking a fine line. And, and I'm not really sure what the law says about that. ... I don't have a moral, kind of objection to people making money from this if they... You know, because like I said a lot of these people are incredibly talented... [...] I think the authors get the short shrift. I think they, I think they, they should get paid too, so, if an artist is going to get paid.

I kind of wish I hadn't been so naive early on (laughs) I guess about people and, and how crazy people can be, because, you know, you can get pretty emotionally hurt by people online. It took a long time for me to really understand that this is just how people are and the internet has kind of let loose all the crazy. It took me a while to get, kind of build a thicker skin. Thankfully, most of my work has been pretty well received and yeah, nobody has like "You're horrible!" That kind of stuff. But, uh... But, yeah, I just... I wish I'd been a little less naive and I would have had my feelings hurt a lot less.

[My advice for a fan today]: Just have fun. You know, enjoy it. Try not to get too serious about it, because the thing that destroys fun for me is when people start saying well, it has to be this way. You know, this is the only way you can look at this pairing. Or, this is the only way these characters can be portrayed. And, so stay away from folks who are kind of... close-minded. One of the things that attracts us to these things, these characters is there's something really universal about all of them. And that they are malleable, and you can sort of direct them into really, really incredibly exciting and, and different directions. And that has to do with your creativity. And again, that's what I would, I would say to younger folks is just, you know, let your creativity flow. And, and don't be worried about somebody saying "Oh, no! You can't do that!"

I've just been really fortunate [in fandom and as a fan] and, and and lucky, to be able to do this. It's just been a hell of a lot of fun. And I'd, and I'd urge anyone who, you know... I mean, it's just a place to be creative and to do stuff you enjoy. And I'm just really, really fortunate.

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